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warning if you like your UFO literature

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to confirm what you already know this is

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not the book for you from white crow

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books comes a brand-new collection of

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essays fourteen authors one goal to

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shatter the UFO topic and pick up the

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pieces in a whole new light compiled and

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edited by Robbie Graham with a foreword

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by Professor Diana Walsh basillica UFOs

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reframing the debate is a cold hard slap

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in the face for ufology delivered with

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love UFOs reframing the debate available

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now in paperback and ebook

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on Amazon and at Barnes & Noble the Book

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Depository and the iBooks store for a

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complete list of contributors and to

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learn more visit Robbie Graham UK this

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is somewhere in the skies inspired

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[Music]

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welcome to somewhere in the skies I'm

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your host Ryan spread a lot of wish each

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and every one of you a very happy new

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year

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I hope your resolutions this 2018 turn

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out to be successful and rewarding for

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the show my resolution is to bring you

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more content and more guests that you

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may have never heard for any people I

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strive to make someoneís guys different

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from every other UFO or paranormal

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podcast out there and with your help I

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can make that happen both the quality

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and quantity to my patreon subscribers

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thank you so much for your monthly

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support more bonus content and even

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bigger rewards are coming your way this

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year and I can't wait to share those

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with you very soon

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to learn more and to become a patron

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visit patreon.com backslash summoner

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scott's on today's show

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I thought you'd start the new year with

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a bang I am speaking with prolific

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author and screenwriter marine Dee Jones

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we talk in depth about her books which

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cover many topics such as money control

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time prompt phenomenon the deja vu and

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Eggman and so much more and of course we

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cover UFOs naturally so without further

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ado let's celebrate 2018 with this

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tell us where your interest sort of in

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the paranormal the fringe the esoteric

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where it all sort of began and I don't

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know why but ever since I was really

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little I'm not talking like 345 years

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old I have been like a UFO alien fanatic

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and and I loved ghost stories and to me

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even at that young and age I was I was

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reading and writing when I was really

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young I think I started it you know

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before - and at least I love to read

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ghost stories and then make up my own

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and tape them but for some reason I was

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really obsessed with UFOs and the fae

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thing is and so is my dad my dad was he

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died a few years ago but he was a

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geophysicist he was a scientist and he

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had this you know a sort of secret

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passion for UFOs and it turns out that

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where I grew up in New York what our

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neighbor across the street who was an

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artist he was a big UFO but - so he'd

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bring these old cool books over and I

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remember the UFOs than the three men in

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these dog-eared paperbacks that were so

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cool I couldn't wait to get my hands on

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him and it just stuck with me all my

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life I never I can't pinpoint an event

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that happened when I was really young

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that might have made me interested I

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think I just kind of was born that way

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and growing that were the scientists

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father was really cool because I had

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this interest in the paranormal and UFOs

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and the unseen world but I also grew up

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with a really strong appreciation for

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science and I always thought that the

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two were were connected and I think most

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of what I plan to do when I started

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writing in this field was find the

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connection absolutely that's incredible

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now did your did your father ever show

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any interest in the paranormal or was it

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ever a conversation you had

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absolutely yeah okay so this when I was

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really young maybe about seven years old

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this is what if one of those you know

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defining moments for my life was when my

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dad would have some of his colleagues

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over and so you know they could be

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astrophysicists oceanographers

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geologists seismologists they would sit

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around our little small round kitchen

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table smoking and having a beer talking

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about UFOs and I would sit underneath

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the table like holding onto my dad's

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chair listening and so that really

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struck me from that young and age that

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there are a lot of scientists out there

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who's loved this stuff but they can't

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you know they couldn't really talk about

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it in the halls of academia they

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couldn't talk about it openly because of

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their professions and that went on for a

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long long time now nowadays what's

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really cool about that channel on a

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scientists that are writing books and

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the book allows them the ability to

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express their interest in the paranormal

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UFOs you know potential alien

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civilizations without it really really

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interfering with any kind of university

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related work that they do and that's

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really opened it up but oh you know my

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dad before he died he lived in Las Vegas

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for many years and whenever we would

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what he would call me right call him our

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conversations were either about the

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paranormal or great horse race horses

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we're both really into that but it's

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just so fascinating because my dad

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actually encouraged me to write what

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ended up being 11 11 the type run

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phenomenon with Larry Flaxman because he

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said you need to look into the

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paranormal nature of numbers and I was

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like yeah really

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I hate numbers I hate math whatever and

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he was right so as a scientist he was

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able to see that there still an

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unexplained unseen level to reality or

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maybe many levels to reality that just

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because science can't explain them yet

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they shouldn't completely brush under

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the rug absolutely I mean we always hear

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that sort of the paranormal is just

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science we haven't discovered yet

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come play yes that's interesting also

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that you brought up Moravia the book

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1111 so back in 2015 about for about two

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months straight I found myself on a very

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sporadic schedule in my wife I'd wake up

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at different times my work schedule was

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all over the place and I just wasn't

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following any type of routine but one

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thing seemed to always happen to me

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every single day I would take a chance

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glance at both the digital and regular

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clocks in my apartment and I always

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catch them right at guess what 11:11 and

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this continued whether a.m. or p.m. like

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I said for about two months I did some

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digging into this certain time and

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number sequence and guess what popped up

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you know can you tell us a little about

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that book and sort of your thoughts on

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this almost synchronistic number now one

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of the reasons why I really enjoyed

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working with Larry is because he is the

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same as I am we we try to stay objective

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we try to look at all sides of something

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and we really do come out something a

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little bit more from the scientific /

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sceptical point of view but I think that

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that's required in the paranormal

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because and I'm not saying skeptic to

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the point where you don't believe in

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anything I'm saying skeptic to the point

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where you stay detached from adopting a

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particular belief or opinion until

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you've seen a lot of you know evidence

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circumstantial evidence even so well we

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set out to write the book we had

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actually believe it or not my dad had

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said that to me

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but what prompted writing the book was

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my publisher new page books said we'd

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like because I said I want to write a

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book with this Larry claps I mean it was

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gonna be our first book together and

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they said well why don't you look into

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this 11:11 phenomenon and I called Larry

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and I said huh what what is he and he

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was like I don't know let's google it

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and we were really completely blown

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way by how many people all over the

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world going back to the 1960s had seen

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this particular time prompt other time

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prompts too but the one in particular so

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because you know there isn't enough to

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write about 11:11 for a whole book it

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really did evolve into a book that looks

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at the very mystical metaphysical

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paranormal nature of numbers I mean

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really numbers are the language of the

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universe on everything that it that

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describes life and how life came about

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and the galaxies and stars and the

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chemicals that all can't get there to

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form life it all is based on

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mathematical ratios and different

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mathematical you know concoctions if you

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will and that was so fascinating so but

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with the 11:11 thing what was really

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cool is we started talking to a lot of

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people doing the research and we found

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two two different avenues so the first

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one I'll give you the boring one and

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that is very simply that you know your

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brain sees something once big deal it

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sees something twice still not too big

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of a deal

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but after that if your brain sees

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something again it really does establish

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a new neural network little pattern

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whereby your brain will then seek out

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that particular thing whether it's a

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number sequence or a word or an image

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it'll seek it out and our brains do this

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in order to make order out of chaos and

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to look for patterns and it's very

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scientific very basic very boring so the

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more people that hear about 11:11 we

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would anticipate that the more people

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would start to do this their their

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subconscious would kind of lock into oh

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you know my friend Josie's 11:11 all the

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time well all of a sudden now their

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brain is forcing them to look at a clock

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at just that time it's almost like when

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you go to bed at night you said I got to

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get up at 5:00 in the morning my alarm

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is busted and somehow you wake up at

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10:00 to 5:00 I mean I do that I don't

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know if you do so that was the boring

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explanation and you know I

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to lean towards that because I've seen

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that happen in my you know Larry and I

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tested it out and it like for me three

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three three I wake up every morning at

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three thirty three well because it's

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become a habit

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I anticipate it so it did but so on the

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other go the more interesting

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explanation is it you know millions of

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people are associating that particular

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number sequence of eleven eleven with

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synchronicities coincidences that will

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happen that just blows them away just

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real powerful moments of just you know

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that pure present moment awareness which

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i think is really what this is all about

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and seeing angels or spirits or whatever

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that their spirit guides are trying to

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get in touch with that was like when

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you're on Facebook and you poke somebody

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so the eleven eleven could be like a

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universal poke what was really cool is

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that we found out that there was this

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little link to December 21st 2012 that

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whole scenario and that is that someone

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had found that the moment of the

273
00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:32,320
beginning of the road is it not the

274
00:12:39,420 --> 00:12:34,210
winter equinox what's the other one come

275
00:12:41,670 --> 00:12:39,430
on the Solstice thank you with eleven

276
00:12:44,250 --> 00:12:41,680
eleven Greenwich Mean Time on that

277
00:12:46,010 --> 00:12:44,260
particular day and so we thought oh you

278
00:12:48,540 --> 00:12:46,020
know that is really cool that's probably

279
00:12:50,280 --> 00:12:48,550
embedded in the subconscious of a lot of

280
00:12:52,530 --> 00:12:50,290
people and maybe there is something to

281
00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:52,540
it we're not in a position to say what

282
00:12:57,300 --> 00:12:54,610
this is it just try to show the

283
00:12:58,830 --> 00:12:57,310
different possibilities but if you see a

284
00:13:02,010 --> 00:12:58,840
lot eleven all the time it it doesn't

285
00:13:04,260 --> 00:13:02,020
bother you and in fact if there brings

286
00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:04,270
you into the present moment because

287
00:13:07,830 --> 00:13:06,130
you've been distracted by thoughts of

288
00:13:10,050 --> 00:13:07,840
the past or the future worries and

289
00:13:11,790 --> 00:13:10,060
concerns I think that's a good thing and

290
00:13:14,070 --> 00:13:11,800
if it's happening to a lot of people I

291
00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:14,080
can't imagine it being a negative great

292
00:13:18,030 --> 00:13:15,970
point I mean a lot of people told me

293
00:13:20,850 --> 00:13:18,040
when I sort of was searching for answers

294
00:13:23,490 --> 00:13:20,860
was very similar to what you said it's

295
00:13:25,890 --> 00:13:23,500
it's an awareness you you're starting to

296
00:13:28,770 --> 00:13:25,900
hone in on something and it's just

297
00:13:30,900 --> 00:13:28,780
distractions around you are sort of

298
00:13:32,940 --> 00:13:30,910
fading away and you're living in the

299
00:13:34,540 --> 00:13:32,950
moment like you said I think that one

300
00:13:38,590 --> 00:13:34,550
yeah

301
00:13:41,110 --> 00:13:38,600
a number of people said well when I see

302
00:13:42,699 --> 00:13:41,120
11 11 or her four four four twelve

303
00:13:45,220 --> 00:13:42,709
twelve whatever their particular time

304
00:13:47,290 --> 00:13:45,230
prompted is that I'm pulled back into

305
00:13:49,150 --> 00:13:47,300
the present because I was just worrying

306
00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:49,160
about an interview I have tomorrow I was

307
00:13:53,590 --> 00:13:51,290
stressing out over a conversation I had

308
00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:53,600
three weeks ago and it pulls them back

309
00:13:57,400 --> 00:13:55,370
into the present and a lot of people say

310
00:13:59,949 --> 00:13:57,410
you know what then some really cool

311
00:14:02,290 --> 00:13:59,959
synchronistic event would occur I say

312
00:14:05,290 --> 00:14:02,300
you know if you didn't notice that 11 11

313
00:14:06,759 --> 00:14:05,300
or 12 12 you didn't get pulled back into

314
00:14:10,030 --> 00:14:06,769
the present you might have just walked

315
00:14:12,610 --> 00:14:10,040
right on by that synchronistic event you

316
00:14:14,620 --> 00:14:12,620
never even noticed it and it's so wild

317
00:14:17,290 --> 00:14:14,630
because I know that that's happened to

318
00:14:21,220 --> 00:14:17,300
me I'm not honed in on the present I'm

319
00:14:24,579 --> 00:14:21,230
missing so much of what's going on in my

320
00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:24,589
reality right right it's a good point

321
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:26,810
and I mean you you even say in the book

322
00:14:32,230 --> 00:14:28,970
as Pythagoras once said all his numbers

323
00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:32,240
it is isn't that awful I mean I balance

324
00:14:42,460 --> 00:14:35,690
a checkbook I'm kind of like well if I

325
00:14:45,010 --> 00:14:42,470
haven't gotten a I always hated numbers

326
00:14:48,220 --> 00:14:45,020
I hate math ah same here that's why

327
00:14:50,860 --> 00:14:48,230
we're writers yeah but now I have

328
00:14:54,819 --> 00:14:50,870
because of writing that book I have this

329
00:14:57,639 --> 00:14:54,829
absolute profound respect for numbers

330
00:14:59,740 --> 00:14:57,649
and you know we talk about aliens and

331
00:15:01,690 --> 00:14:59,750
communicating with aliens all the time

332
00:15:05,500 --> 00:15:01,700
you and I and and the people that we

333
00:15:08,079 --> 00:15:05,510
hang out with the weird about it they're

334
00:15:10,030 --> 00:15:08,089
not if we interact with an alien

335
00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:10,040
civilization they're not going to speak

336
00:15:14,769 --> 00:15:13,630
any kind of language that is Earth's

337
00:15:18,340 --> 00:15:14,779
originated

338
00:15:21,610 --> 00:15:18,350
why won't they the language that any

339
00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:21,620
other civilization out there is going to

340
00:15:25,990 --> 00:15:23,690
understand out of sheer necessity is

341
00:15:29,139 --> 00:15:26,000
mathematics and I don't mean I'm not the

342
00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:29,149
one creating that theory I heard that

343
00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:32,930
from Carl Sagan and and Stephen Hawking

344
00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:35,690
and Michio Kaku I mean they're the

345
00:15:40,210 --> 00:15:37,850
reason why those people are so attracted

346
00:15:43,389 --> 00:15:40,220
to the world of physics is because of

347
00:15:46,430 --> 00:15:43,399
the mathematics behind it that really

348
00:15:50,300 --> 00:15:46,440
can explain so much and

349
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:50,310
so mix up such a basic language that

350
00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:53,010
anybody can understand I mean music is

351
00:15:58,880 --> 00:15:56,010
based on on mathematics in numbers if

352
00:16:00,920 --> 00:15:58,890
you think about adding harmonics so that

353
00:16:02,270 --> 00:16:00,930
really fascinated me that you know

354
00:16:07,100 --> 00:16:02,280
they're not going to come down and speak

355
00:16:08,680 --> 00:16:07,110
English Spanish Chinese you know it's

356
00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:08,690
gonna be some kind of mathematical

357
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:13,170
signal or message well speaking of

358
00:16:20,420 --> 00:16:16,410
messages Maryam one of your earlier

359
00:16:23,510 --> 00:16:20,430
books I found of great interest and it

360
00:16:26,750 --> 00:16:23,520
involved a sensation we've all felt at

361
00:16:29,180 --> 00:16:26,760
one time or another in our life you know

362
00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:29,190
rushes over us and it leaves us

363
00:16:33,770 --> 00:16:31,530
wondering have I done this before that

364
00:16:35,660 --> 00:16:33,780
book is the deja vu and nygma journey

365
00:16:43,030 --> 00:16:35,670
through anomalies of mind memory and

366
00:16:51,050 --> 00:16:47,560
it's like it's all happened before yeah

367
00:16:52,250 --> 00:16:51,060
well you know when Larry and I sit down

368
00:16:54,230 --> 00:16:52,260
to think about what you're right about

369
00:16:58,310 --> 00:16:54,240
next I'm truthfully we're running out of

370
00:16:59,600 --> 00:16:58,320
ideas deja vu has always seemed to us as

371
00:17:02,330 --> 00:16:59,610
sort of it you know they took about a

372
00:17:06,230 --> 00:17:02,340
gateway drug no marijuana yeah it was

373
00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:06,240
the gateway drug - right but excuse me

374
00:17:14,090 --> 00:17:08,970
it was almost like a gateway experience

375
00:17:16,490 --> 00:17:14,100
to bigger paranormal experiences and and

376
00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:16,500
I say that because deja vu is something

377
00:17:22,370 --> 00:17:18,329
that has pretty much happened to almost

378
00:17:24,260 --> 00:17:22,380
everybody it's extremely common it

379
00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:24,270
happens more than once usually in your

380
00:17:29,050 --> 00:17:26,490
lifetime everybody knows what it feels

381
00:17:32,090 --> 00:17:29,060
like and it's one of those experiences

382
00:17:34,100 --> 00:17:32,100
that the medical community and the

383
00:17:36,110 --> 00:17:34,110
scientific community have struggled Nick

384
00:17:38,870 --> 00:17:36,120
really poured a lot of research dollars

385
00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:38,880
and time into it believe it or not but

386
00:17:42,140 --> 00:17:40,290
they've really struggled to understand

387
00:17:44,870 --> 00:17:42,150
what the mechanisms are in the brain

388
00:17:47,270 --> 00:17:44,880
that are causing deja vu well they know

389
00:17:49,250 --> 00:17:47,280
what the mechanisms are but what they

390
00:17:51,670 --> 00:17:49,260
have not been able to figure out is what

391
00:17:54,670 --> 00:17:51,680
prompts them what triggers them

392
00:17:56,620 --> 00:17:54,680
and why does ever happens when it

393
00:17:58,660 --> 00:17:56,630
happens which is you know totally

394
00:18:00,520 --> 00:17:58,670
spontaneously you really can't say oh I

395
00:18:02,410 --> 00:18:00,530
think I'm gonna have deja vu at 3

396
00:18:04,900 --> 00:18:02,420
o'clock today and it happens in very

397
00:18:06,850 --> 00:18:04,910
organic settings so you can study

398
00:18:09,430 --> 00:18:06,860
something in a clinical setting and get

399
00:18:10,780 --> 00:18:09,440
one set of information but until you can

400
00:18:14,980 --> 00:18:10,790
figure out how it happens spontaneously

401
00:18:16,630 --> 00:18:14,990
in a non clinical setting so it's was

402
00:18:19,360 --> 00:18:16,640
really cool for us to start researching

403
00:18:22,030 --> 00:18:19,370
deja vu and the anomalies of the mind

404
00:18:26,380 --> 00:18:22,040
which have fascinated us for a long time

405
00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:26,390
and see how little understanding of this

406
00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:29,450
gateway experience there really was and

407
00:18:37,270 --> 00:18:33,970
also how a lot of current research is

408
00:18:41,350 --> 00:18:37,280
was opening up to the possibility that

409
00:18:45,460 --> 00:18:41,360
deja vu could be an experience involving

410
00:18:48,340 --> 00:18:45,470
another timeline a parallel universe an

411
00:18:50,830 --> 00:18:48,350
alternate dimension of the experience of

412
00:18:53,260 --> 00:18:50,840
another reality we exist in both and

413
00:18:56,110 --> 00:18:53,270
when they sort of come into alignment at

414
00:18:58,330 --> 00:18:56,120
those just those few seconds you

415
00:18:59,950 --> 00:18:58,340
experience deja vu and the fact that a

416
00:19:02,380 --> 00:18:59,960
lot of people have deja vu they either

417
00:19:05,140 --> 00:19:02,390
have straight deja vu but some go into a

418
00:19:08,740 --> 00:19:05,150
precognitive experience some have passed

419
00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:08,750
like recall some have you know start

420
00:19:14,170 --> 00:19:11,330
feeling sort of telekinetic or whatever

421
00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:14,180
so it really is this weird gateway

422
00:19:20,230 --> 00:19:16,570
experience that is still quite

423
00:19:23,170 --> 00:19:20,240
misunderstood right and I imagines you

424
00:19:25,540 --> 00:19:23,180
know the more we look into the the

425
00:19:27,460 --> 00:19:25,550
theories of lucid dreaming that perhaps

426
00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:27,470
that could even be a connection to this

427
00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:31,130
all as well I know where we are both on

428
00:19:36,490 --> 00:19:32,930
the paranormal community and one of the

429
00:19:40,180 --> 00:19:36,500
things that's really always bothered me

430
00:19:42,190 --> 00:19:40,190
but but all fascinated but also kind of

431
00:19:44,890 --> 00:19:42,200
bothered me a little is the focus on

432
00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:44,900
external events you know we chase ghosts

433
00:19:49,150 --> 00:19:46,610
we look for UFOs

434
00:19:50,830 --> 00:19:49,160
what cryptids obviously I mean we're

435
00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:50,840
fascinated but I think that we've

436
00:19:56,740 --> 00:19:53,450
neglected for a long time what goes on

437
00:20:00,580 --> 00:19:56,750
in our own bodies certainly the power of

438
00:20:03,100 --> 00:20:00,590
memory to shake reality the power of

439
00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:03,110
perception the power of belief

440
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:05,090
especially collective

441
00:20:09,730 --> 00:20:07,810
to literally create physical

442
00:20:12,550 --> 00:20:09,740
manifestations

443
00:20:15,370 --> 00:20:12,560
so the mind to me is has always been

444
00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:15,380
that sort of final frontier you know we

445
00:20:20,380 --> 00:20:17,570
were so outward and external we think of

446
00:20:22,750 --> 00:20:20,390
outer space is the final frontier but we

447
00:20:26,230 --> 00:20:22,760
don't even really understand and our own

448
00:20:30,190 --> 00:20:26,240
minds we do not know what reality is

449
00:20:32,590 --> 00:20:30,200
that kills me every time you know nobody

450
00:20:35,260 --> 00:20:32,600
even the most brilliant scientists that

451
00:20:38,020 --> 00:20:35,270
have ever lived should say 100%

452
00:20:40,540 --> 00:20:38,030
certainty what reality is and here we

453
00:20:42,910 --> 00:20:40,550
are trying to grasp things that occur

454
00:20:46,180 --> 00:20:42,920
beyond the sort of scope of everyday

455
00:20:46,930 --> 00:20:46,190
reality so yeah that's a big rabbit hole

456
00:20:49,450 --> 00:20:46,940
to go down

457
00:20:51,010 --> 00:20:49,460
oh very much so very cyclical as well

458
00:20:53,470 --> 00:20:51,020
you know once you start thinking of

459
00:20:55,210 --> 00:20:53,480
reality then you get into perception

460
00:20:56,860 --> 00:20:55,220
consciousness and it lives

461
00:20:58,840 --> 00:20:56,870
that's circling around the same

462
00:21:02,290 --> 00:20:58,850
definition and it is literally

463
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:02,300
mind-blowing it can't at this point yet

464
00:21:09,460 --> 00:21:06,250
in our understanding can't be fathomed

465
00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:09,470
know we have some really good educated

466
00:21:14,770 --> 00:21:12,410
guesses theories but there's still this

467
00:21:17,290 --> 00:21:14,780
huge debate going on over whether the

468
00:21:19,180 --> 00:21:17,300
mind / consciousness is a part of the

469
00:21:21,820 --> 00:21:19,190
brain are separate from it right and

470
00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:21,830
that's me you think that's for a long

471
00:21:27,820 --> 00:21:24,650
time there's still debate going on as to

472
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:27,830
whether our perception shapes reality or

473
00:21:32,830 --> 00:21:31,610
our reality shapes perception so yeah if

474
00:21:34,900 --> 00:21:32,840
you start thinking about it too much

475
00:21:38,200 --> 00:21:34,910
kind of go a little bit crazy and get a

476
00:21:41,620 --> 00:21:38,210
really bad headache but it's I you know

477
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:41,630
to me some of the some of the focus

478
00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:43,850
that's not half of it really needs to be

479
00:21:49,360 --> 00:21:46,730
on our understanding of our own bodies

480
00:21:52,270 --> 00:21:49,370
and minds and consciousness and how we

481
00:21:54,130 --> 00:21:52,280
work in the world and how we operate as

482
00:21:57,100 --> 00:21:54,140
well as the things that are happening

483
00:22:00,820 --> 00:21:57,110
externally hey listen there's a theory

484
00:22:03,460 --> 00:22:00,830
that goes cryptids aliens that nothing

485
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:03,470
you and I that nothing that exists

486
00:22:07,990 --> 00:22:05,210
external to us is real that they're

487
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:08,000
projections from our consciousness onto

488
00:22:13,120 --> 00:22:11,210
a sort of blank landscape that's really

489
00:22:16,360 --> 00:22:13,130
creepy to think about and you would say

490
00:22:19,020 --> 00:22:16,370
well my reality doesn't appear that way

491
00:22:22,980 --> 00:22:19,030
I think Brian I think you're real you're

492
00:22:26,060 --> 00:22:22,990
into me I didn't create you and yet that

493
00:22:31,950 --> 00:22:26,070
is a very valid theory describing a

494
00:22:38,730 --> 00:22:31,960
possible explanation for reality one of

495
00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:38,740
many and many will keep could you

496
00:22:47,190 --> 00:22:43,570
imagine well speaking of the mind Marie

497
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:47,200
I want to touch on probably one of your

498
00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:49,810
most controversial books to date and

499
00:22:56,490 --> 00:22:53,890
that is mind Wars well I know a lot of

500
00:22:58,080 --> 00:22:56,500
people who have read this one later on

501
00:23:00,480 --> 00:22:58,090
in the conversation I'll get to some

502
00:23:02,790 --> 00:23:00,490
listener questions about that's thick

503
00:23:07,290 --> 00:23:02,800
but I have some of my own gonna be a

504
00:23:09,570 --> 00:23:07,300
little selfish here now what were some

505
00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:09,580
of the earliest versions of mind control

506
00:23:17,250 --> 00:23:11,890
you came across in researching this

507
00:23:20,310 --> 00:23:17,260
topic for mind wars well that we have

508
00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:20,320
been using mind control tactics since

509
00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:23,050
the dawn of humanity because it is a

510
00:23:28,860 --> 00:23:27,130
part of human nature it's a basic part

511
00:23:30,780 --> 00:23:28,870
of human nature to want to try to get

512
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:30,790
somebody to do something that you want

513
00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:34,210
them to do and we have learned over time

514
00:23:40,980 --> 00:23:36,850
all kinds of wonderfully manipulative

515
00:23:42,930 --> 00:23:40,990
tactics to achieve that so you know

516
00:23:44,700 --> 00:23:42,940
however long we were walking the earth

517
00:23:46,050 --> 00:23:44,710
or crawling or what-have-you

518
00:23:49,620 --> 00:23:46,060
we've been doing that inner

519
00:23:53,580 --> 00:23:49,630
interpersonal relationships in terms of

520
00:23:55,820 --> 00:23:53,590
a wider scale you know we're going back

521
00:23:59,160 --> 00:23:55,830
like I said in primitive times obviously

522
00:24:02,700 --> 00:23:59,170
the the whole point of life was to

523
00:24:05,910 --> 00:24:02,710
survive and if you had to do anything to

524
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:05,920
survive which included getting to pray

525
00:24:11,670 --> 00:24:07,930
before ever another tribe does or

526
00:24:13,890 --> 00:24:11,680
another group finding shelter getting

527
00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:13,900
the women to reproduce with you if you

528
00:24:17,450 --> 00:24:15,730
were a man and vice versa

529
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:17,460
so that you could keep the line going

530
00:24:22,620 --> 00:24:19,930
there's a lot of manipulation that has

531
00:24:25,170 --> 00:24:22,630
to happen for those things to occur you

532
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:25,180
know don't leave the strong survive but

533
00:24:31,230 --> 00:24:27,490
over time you know in more ancient times

534
00:24:31,750 --> 00:24:31,240
it really became more about ritual it

535
00:24:34,060 --> 00:24:31,760
really big

536
00:24:35,890 --> 00:24:34,070
more about appeasing and pleasing the

537
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:35,900
deities the gods and goddesses of the

538
00:24:42,100 --> 00:24:39,890
time and the idea being that through the

539
00:24:43,780 --> 00:24:42,110
use of ritual and anything and

540
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:43,790
everything that went along with that

541
00:24:49,630 --> 00:24:45,890
some rituals were were perfectly

542
00:24:51,730 --> 00:24:49,640
harmless some were akin to torture what

543
00:24:54,370 --> 00:24:51,740
you were doing is you were being told

544
00:24:56,950 --> 00:24:54,380
you're being taught to get in line to do

545
00:24:59,770 --> 00:24:56,960
whatever the gods and goddesses wanted

546
00:25:02,170 --> 00:24:59,780
you to do to gain favor with them and

547
00:25:04,090 --> 00:25:02,180
oftentimes that was really only the

548
00:25:06,670 --> 00:25:04,100
interpretation of the people who were

549
00:25:10,210 --> 00:25:06,680
behind the rituals the leaders of secret

550
00:25:12,850 --> 00:25:10,220
societies the leaders of religious cults

551
00:25:15,300 --> 00:25:12,860
which really flourished at that time so

552
00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:15,310
in ancient times it was really about

553
00:25:22,830 --> 00:25:20,450
religious and ritual use of manipulating

554
00:25:25,690 --> 00:25:22,840
people's actions thoughts and behaviors

555
00:25:27,340 --> 00:25:25,700
mostly to please the gods sometimes to

556
00:25:30,370 --> 00:25:27,350
please the people that were acting as

557
00:25:33,460 --> 00:25:30,380
the go-between and I'm you know in more

558
00:25:37,150 --> 00:25:33,470
modern times it's everything from cults

559
00:25:40,330 --> 00:25:37,160
that you found out torture to ritual

560
00:25:44,980 --> 00:25:40,340
abuse to project MKULTRA which our own

561
00:25:47,380 --> 00:25:44,990
government was fully aware of right I

562
00:25:49,090 --> 00:25:47,390
was actually gonna ask about MKULTRA I

563
00:25:51,610 --> 00:25:49,100
mean a lot of us in the conspiracy

564
00:25:53,860 --> 00:25:51,620
theorist world we've heard about this

565
00:26:05,260 --> 00:25:53,870
but could you sort of elaborate on what

566
00:26:08,010 --> 00:26:05,270
that project was now everybody's either

567
00:26:10,810 --> 00:26:08,020
seen movies or TV shows or heard about

568
00:26:12,520 --> 00:26:10,820
MKULTRA it still really surprises me how

569
00:26:15,970 --> 00:26:12,530
many people still think it's just a

570
00:26:17,650 --> 00:26:15,980
conspiracy it's not this is a this is a

571
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:17,660
part of American history

572
00:26:22,540 --> 00:26:20,570
and as far as I and many others are

573
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:22,550
concerned it's a black mark on American

574
00:26:29,890 --> 00:26:26,210
history so during the 1950's obviously

575
00:26:31,930 --> 00:26:29,900
one of our concerns as a nation was the

576
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:31,940
fact that our POWs were being

577
00:26:37,060 --> 00:26:33,770
brainwashed and had been brainwashed

578
00:26:40,300 --> 00:26:37,070
during the Korean War then the original

579
00:26:43,750 --> 00:26:40,310
goal of this sort of umbrella operation

580
00:26:44,740 --> 00:26:43,760
that became called MKULTRA which started

581
00:26:46,750 --> 00:26:44,750
out

582
00:26:50,650 --> 00:26:46,760
the precursor of the CIA and then was

583
00:26:54,070 --> 00:26:50,660
later taken over by the CIA was too fine

584
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:54,080
find out what techniques were being used

585
00:27:02,400 --> 00:26:57,170
to brainwash our POWs said that we could

586
00:27:05,910 --> 00:27:02,410
either stop it or you know the offensive

587
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:05,920
side of the things do it ourselves and

588
00:27:14,590 --> 00:27:10,690
it just ended up becoming this massive

589
00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:14,600
program excuse me involving you know

590
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:17,210
over eighty so eighty plus different

591
00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:21,170
types of institutions from colleges and

592
00:27:29,530 --> 00:27:25,490
universities orphanages prisons mental

593
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:29,540
institutions you name it that allowed

594
00:27:34,120 --> 00:27:32,090
these people that were bought in many of

595
00:27:38,670 --> 00:27:34,130
whom were doctors you know scientific

596
00:27:41,820 --> 00:27:38,680
researchers to experiment with drugs

597
00:27:45,580 --> 00:27:41,830
sensory deprivation food deprivation

598
00:27:49,090 --> 00:27:45,590
sexual abuse torture a chemical exposure

599
00:27:52,870 --> 00:27:49,100
all for the goal of trying to learn how

600
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:52,880
to manipulate human behavior and that

601
00:27:58,690 --> 00:27:56,090
includes thought obviously and as them

602
00:28:01,150 --> 00:27:58,700
Kaltura grew and there were some

603
00:28:03,810 --> 00:28:01,160
splinter projects that that came out of

604
00:28:07,900 --> 00:28:03,820
that some of the names chatter artichoke

605
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:07,910
the Bluebird some of the goals became

606
00:28:13,420 --> 00:28:10,850
more about creating the super-soldier

607
00:28:15,790 --> 00:28:13,430
you know can we take a human being

608
00:28:17,410 --> 00:28:15,800
usually a child because they're much

609
00:28:18,460 --> 00:28:17,420
easier to work with their brains are

610
00:28:22,090 --> 00:28:18,470
still being formed

611
00:28:24,130 --> 00:28:22,100
they have no identity point yet wipe out

612
00:28:26,260 --> 00:28:24,140
their personality literally deprogram

613
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:26,270
them that reprogram certain

614
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:28,930
personalities that were called alters

615
00:28:34,660 --> 00:28:32,210
one of which might be an assassin what

616
00:28:36,790 --> 00:28:34,670
if MIT which might be a drug runner one

617
00:28:40,900 --> 00:28:36,800
might be a prostitute you know one might

618
00:28:44,110 --> 00:28:40,910
be the altar that is supposed to forget

619
00:28:47,050 --> 00:28:44,120
all those other things so literally we

620
00:28:51,550 --> 00:28:47,060
were creating this sort of robotic newly

621
00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:51,560
programmed super soldiers that if you've

622
00:28:56,169 --> 00:28:53,450
ever watched The Manchurian Candidate if

623
00:28:58,019 --> 00:28:56,179
you've ever watched conspiracy theory

624
00:28:59,999 --> 00:28:58,029
with Mel Gibson in Julia Roberts

625
00:29:02,639 --> 00:29:00,009
some really good movies out there to get

626
00:29:05,279 --> 00:29:02,649
into this and you know they're fictional

627
00:29:08,639 --> 00:29:05,289
but they're really based on on fact

628
00:29:12,060 --> 00:29:08,649
about what was going on and so

629
00:29:14,430 --> 00:29:12,070
eventually some of the experiments got

630
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:14,440
really unwieldy and some of the victims

631
00:29:19,049 --> 00:29:16,570
started to speak out and they started to

632
00:29:21,839 --> 00:29:19,059
hire lawyers and there were a couple of

633
00:29:23,279 --> 00:29:21,849
congressional hearings and you know a

634
00:29:28,049 --> 00:29:23,289
Senate hearing where a lot of it was

635
00:29:32,729 --> 00:29:28,059
exposed and in the mid 1970s and hey

636
00:29:34,079 --> 00:29:32,739
ultra was officially closed however that

637
00:29:38,789 --> 00:29:34,089
doesn't mean it stopped

638
00:29:41,419 --> 00:29:38,799
basically we assumed that all of that

639
00:29:44,669 --> 00:29:41,429
continued in some form of or another

640
00:29:47,759 --> 00:29:44,679
under different names you know much

641
00:29:49,879 --> 00:29:47,769
deeper black programs and that they were

642
00:29:54,149 --> 00:29:49,889
very very careful from that point on to

643
00:29:55,709 --> 00:29:54,159
not you know to have these projects be

644
00:29:57,899 --> 00:29:55,719
small enough where they couldn't really

645
00:29:59,940 --> 00:29:57,909
be caught on to as easily this stuff

646
00:30:02,549 --> 00:29:59,950
still goes on today I mean I talked to a

647
00:30:03,810 --> 00:30:02,559
woman who worked in prison system and

648
00:30:05,759 --> 00:30:03,820
she said they're still being

649
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:05,769
experimented on without their will or

650
00:30:09,119 --> 00:30:07,690
you know they're or they're forced to

651
00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:09,129
they're told you're never going to get

652
00:30:13,169 --> 00:30:10,570
out of here unless you take this new

653
00:30:15,619 --> 00:30:13,179
drug and tell us what happens so it's

654
00:30:18,599 --> 00:30:15,629
still going on now today we have surveil

655
00:30:21,359 --> 00:30:18,609
once so the mind-control techniques of

656
00:30:23,509 --> 00:30:21,369
today or more surveillance oriented or

657
00:30:26,070 --> 00:30:23,519
you have the best medium to do Malaysian

658
00:30:27,659 --> 00:30:26,080
MKULTRA anybody wants to look into it

659
00:30:30,599 --> 00:30:27,669
it's not a joke and it's not a

660
00:30:32,489 --> 00:30:30,609
conspiracy it happened it happened it's

661
00:30:34,829 --> 00:30:32,499
very real and like you said I mean

662
00:30:36,749 --> 00:30:34,839
there's forms of this still happening

663
00:30:42,479 --> 00:30:36,759
today and like you mentioned the mass

664
00:30:46,079 --> 00:30:42,489
media what do you think is the best case

665
00:30:48,479 --> 00:30:46,089
example Marie of the media influencing

666
00:30:50,820 --> 00:30:48,489
the public you know compared to maybe 20

667
00:31:02,849 --> 00:30:50,830
years ago 30 years ago what are we

668
00:31:04,979 --> 00:31:02,859
looking at now in 2016 you know okay so

669
00:31:07,079 --> 00:31:04,989
we have an election going on it's

670
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:07,089
election cycle we're in the primaries

671
00:31:11,510 --> 00:31:09,050
and

672
00:31:14,450 --> 00:31:11,520
there is an awful lot of corruption

673
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:14,460
there is voter theft there is voter

674
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:18,050
fraud I've seen it I've seen proof of it

675
00:31:23,870 --> 00:31:21,690
the mass media are not reporting the

676
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:23,880
mass media have chosen for the United

677
00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:26,370
States of America which two candidates

678
00:31:32,780 --> 00:31:30,090
they prefer and any evidence to the

679
00:31:36,470 --> 00:31:32,790
contrary is being ignored shoved under

680
00:31:38,270 --> 00:31:36,480
the rug or called conspiracy theory and

681
00:31:40,970 --> 00:31:38,280
that's why the best ways that you stop

682
00:31:44,540 --> 00:31:40,980
your opponent if your opponent says I

683
00:31:47,960 --> 00:31:44,550
witnessed this happening and you know

684
00:31:49,700 --> 00:31:47,970
this person here is is correct but

685
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:49,710
you're gonna be called a conspiracy

686
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:51,090
theorist that's the first way that they

687
00:31:55,100 --> 00:31:53,130
sort of categorize you as being crazy

688
00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:55,110
sometime people pay attention to you

689
00:31:59,570 --> 00:31:57,090
problem is now is that we have this

690
00:32:02,780 --> 00:31:59,580
thing called the internet and we have

691
00:32:04,700 --> 00:32:02,790
social networking and even though social

692
00:32:06,410 --> 00:32:04,710
networking has its own issues when it

693
00:32:08,990 --> 00:32:06,420
comes to mind control which we can talk

694
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:09,000
about a little bit yes it does allow for

695
00:32:14,510 --> 00:32:11,730
the the dissemination of information to

696
00:32:16,580 --> 00:32:14,520
happen immediately so in this particular

697
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:16,590
election I don't care who you like or

698
00:32:21,470 --> 00:32:19,170
who you're voting for the truth is there

699
00:32:24,170 --> 00:32:21,480
is massive voter theft and voter fraud

700
00:32:27,530 --> 00:32:24,180
going on mainly in the democratic

701
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:27,540
process and and that really breaks my

702
00:32:34,460 --> 00:32:29,490
heart because I've been a lifelong

703
00:32:36,770 --> 00:32:34,470
Democrat party because of it so what

704
00:32:38,570 --> 00:32:36,780
happens is in past elections there's

705
00:32:41,900 --> 00:32:38,580
always been voter fraud always it's just

706
00:32:44,390 --> 00:32:41,910
a part of the election process the

707
00:32:45,860 --> 00:32:44,400
powers that be have their chosen

708
00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:45,870
candidates they're gonna sink the most

709
00:32:50,690 --> 00:32:47,610
money into it they're gonna buy media

710
00:32:52,250 --> 00:32:50,700
time and in many cases because the

711
00:32:54,860 --> 00:32:52,260
media's are owned by specific

712
00:32:58,580 --> 00:32:54,870
corporations and conglomerates but the

713
00:33:00,530 --> 00:32:58,590
news people literally have to speak the

714
00:33:02,390 --> 00:33:00,540
stories that they are given and those

715
00:33:04,940 --> 00:33:02,400
stories are not news it's been it's

716
00:33:08,030 --> 00:33:04,950
propaganda that's how it works

717
00:33:12,170 --> 00:33:08,040
and the problem that we have right now

718
00:33:15,290 --> 00:33:12,180
is that we are being told that things

719
00:33:16,850 --> 00:33:15,300
are the way they are where you get on

720
00:33:19,490 --> 00:33:16,860
the internet you start doing your own

721
00:33:20,540 --> 00:33:19,500
homework and you are talking to the

722
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:20,550
people that are on the

723
00:33:25,310 --> 00:33:22,650
and you see that it is very different

724
00:33:27,460 --> 00:33:25,320
from what the mass media is and that's

725
00:33:31,060 --> 00:33:27,470
the really probably the strongest

726
00:33:35,230 --> 00:33:31,070
example that people will understand is

727
00:33:38,330 --> 00:33:35,240
how the media works in collusion with

728
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:38,340
either corporations like Monsanto to

729
00:33:44,750 --> 00:33:41,250
make them look good you know big pharma

730
00:33:48,230 --> 00:33:44,760
big agribusiness and certain politicians

731
00:33:50,390 --> 00:33:48,240
to keep the public unaware of what's

732
00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:50,400
happening on a deeper level of reality

733
00:33:53,930 --> 00:33:51,930
and a deeper level of reality is that

734
00:33:56,570 --> 00:33:53,940
there is a massive revolution going on

735
00:33:58,460 --> 00:33:56,580
in this country there are there's an

736
00:34:02,480 --> 00:33:58,470
independent revolution going on that a

737
00:34:04,850 --> 00:34:02,490
lot of people don't know about so that's

738
00:34:06,740 --> 00:34:04,860
a good example you know many many years

739
00:34:08,240 --> 00:34:06,750
that it was all about sibling subliminal

740
00:34:11,390 --> 00:34:08,250
advertising and getting you to buy

741
00:34:12,919 --> 00:34:11,400
certain products well they still do that

742
00:34:15,560 --> 00:34:12,929
I mean there's you know I watch The

743
00:34:18,820 --> 00:34:15,570
Walking Dead I think 80% of the show is

744
00:34:22,250 --> 00:34:18,830
commercials you know right by mass media

745
00:34:25,030 --> 00:34:22,260
manipulation don't watch mainstream news

746
00:34:29,330 --> 00:34:25,040
you're not getting news you are getting

747
00:34:31,669 --> 00:34:29,340
sponsored news spin okay it's not

748
00:34:33,500 --> 00:34:31,679
factual you need to go find the facts on

749
00:34:35,630 --> 00:34:33,510
your own but most people won't take the

750
00:34:38,210 --> 00:34:35,640
time to do that right yeah I mean we

751
00:34:41,890 --> 00:34:38,220
it's surprising to me that people do

752
00:34:44,900 --> 00:34:41,900
still consider you know certain news

753
00:34:47,510 --> 00:34:44,910
outlets as their main source and it's

754
00:34:51,020 --> 00:34:47,520
just it's incredible yeah and they're

755
00:34:53,240 --> 00:34:51,030
all correct no I mean I remember I'm old

756
00:34:57,110 --> 00:34:53,250
enough to remember many many years ago

757
00:34:58,430 --> 00:34:57,120
when I could watch Fox's oh he's had

758
00:35:01,550 --> 00:34:58,440
their bias and they've always been very

759
00:35:03,260 --> 00:35:01,560
open about it MSNBC was kind of new at

760
00:35:05,150 --> 00:35:03,270
the time but CNN had been around for a

761
00:35:08,060 --> 00:35:05,160
long time a little bit of a left lean

762
00:35:11,060 --> 00:35:08,070
but they always were very focused on

763
00:35:12,830 --> 00:35:11,070
trying to get good journalism and trying

764
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:12,840
to report the facts this is a long time

765
00:35:17,660 --> 00:35:14,970
ago people so if you're watching CNN now

766
00:35:19,550 --> 00:35:17,670
don't trust it and I don't know you know

767
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:19,560
I think it really was sort of around the

768
00:35:25,690 --> 00:35:22,530
time of the gore Bush election and then

769
00:35:28,730 --> 00:35:25,700
the Iraq war where there needed to be

770
00:35:30,430 --> 00:35:28,740
massive media manipulation to get the

771
00:35:33,309 --> 00:35:30,440
public to go along with a war

772
00:35:36,569 --> 00:35:33,319
it really was totally unwarranted that

773
00:35:40,540 --> 00:35:36,579
that's really there was a huge shift in

774
00:35:43,359 --> 00:35:40,550
CNN and MSNBC to where I began to see

775
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:43,369
sponsored news and it's like oh my gosh

776
00:35:47,530 --> 00:35:45,410
and then on my local news

777
00:35:49,720 --> 00:35:47,540
I watched my local news for the sports

778
00:35:51,819 --> 00:35:49,730
because I left sports and the weather

779
00:35:53,980 --> 00:35:51,829
and I live in San Diego so it's not like

780
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:53,990
we really had a lot of weather as soon

781
00:35:59,020 --> 00:35:56,650
as they start talking about politics or

782
00:36:02,530 --> 00:35:59,030
you know this that and the other thing I

783
00:36:05,500 --> 00:36:02,540
turned it off because I know I've seen

784
00:36:07,240 --> 00:36:05,510
enough of that I'm aware now I know you

785
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:07,250
know there are different names for some

786
00:36:10,900 --> 00:36:08,810
of them in a manipulative techniques

787
00:36:13,690 --> 00:36:10,910
they're using I know a mall after

788
00:36:16,050 --> 00:36:13,700
researching and writing this book what

789
00:36:23,050 --> 00:36:16,060
you're aware of it you can't not see it

790
00:36:25,359 --> 00:36:23,060
right I mean it for me Marie I just saw

791
00:36:28,599 --> 00:36:25,369
today a trailer for a new Oliver Stone

792
00:36:31,210 --> 00:36:28,609
movie starring one of my favorite actors

793
00:36:37,690 --> 00:36:31,220
Joseph gordon-levitt who will be playing

794
00:36:39,940 --> 00:36:37,700
Edward Snowden in the I recently also

795
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:39,950
saw the documentary citizen four also

796
00:36:46,900 --> 00:36:45,050
based on Snowden what have you

797
00:36:50,380 --> 00:36:46,910
discovered in your research into

798
00:36:52,780 --> 00:36:50,390
surveillance today in America in terms

799
00:36:55,569 --> 00:36:52,790
of what has been leaked by Snowden and

800
00:36:57,280 --> 00:36:55,579
you know WikiLeaks and whatnot what does

801
00:36:59,500 --> 00:36:57,290
this tell us about where we stand today

802
00:37:03,250 --> 00:36:59,510
as a country in terms of surveillance

803
00:37:07,180 --> 00:37:03,260
and how much of a hold these

804
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:07,190
corporations and probably them you know

805
00:37:13,780 --> 00:37:09,890
the military-industrial complex might

806
00:37:17,250 --> 00:37:13,790
have on the public well let's put it

807
00:37:22,540 --> 00:37:17,260
this way you have no privacy none

808
00:37:24,069 --> 00:37:22,550
absolutely none now does that mean that

809
00:37:27,309 --> 00:37:24,079
you can never do anything in private

810
00:37:29,829 --> 00:37:27,319
yeah what I mean is you're being watched

811
00:37:34,930 --> 00:37:29,839
constantly whether by satellite

812
00:37:38,650 --> 00:37:34,940
technology drones cameras your computer

813
00:37:42,309 --> 00:37:38,660
if you're on like your cell phones smart

814
00:37:43,750 --> 00:37:42,319
TV these smart appliances what-have-you

815
00:37:45,849 --> 00:37:43,760
we have no privacy any

816
00:37:47,530 --> 00:37:45,859
yeah we can still find ways to have

817
00:37:49,510 --> 00:37:47,540
private moments in our home you know

818
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:49,520
what happens you just have to be aware

819
00:37:54,970 --> 00:37:52,970
of the fact that those things are out

820
00:37:57,790 --> 00:37:54,980
there and that you're very limited into

821
00:38:01,000 --> 00:37:57,800
how you can avoid them I was absolutely

822
00:38:02,620 --> 00:38:01,010
blown away when we were bright maybe the

823
00:38:05,140 --> 00:38:02,630
part about surveillance because Larry

824
00:38:07,330 --> 00:38:05,150
Flaxman works for Department Homeland

825
00:38:11,290 --> 00:38:07,340
Security and he's also worked in cyber

826
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:11,300
terrorism and I remember asking him you

827
00:38:17,230 --> 00:38:14,810
know I like I said you know I'm worried

828
00:38:19,950 --> 00:38:17,240
about my cell phone because at the time

829
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:19,960
when we were writing my new Hearst my

830
00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:23,330
desktop computer started taking pictures

831
00:38:28,750 --> 00:38:26,930
of me my camera would go off and I

832
00:38:30,370 --> 00:38:28,760
thought well that's really weird and I

833
00:38:32,920 --> 00:38:30,380
asked my son and he's pretty tech savvy

834
00:38:34,450 --> 00:38:32,930
and he said it could just be a glitch

835
00:38:37,090 --> 00:38:34,460
but it let me know if it keeps happening

836
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:37,100
and it kept happening and he said you

837
00:38:42,190 --> 00:38:39,050
know Mom somebody could you know someone

838
00:38:44,530 --> 00:38:42,200
could so easily have gotten into your

839
00:38:45,970 --> 00:38:44,540
computer whatever and they're taking

840
00:38:47,800 --> 00:38:45,980
pictures of you that happens all the

841
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:47,810
time and he said just cover it up and I

842
00:38:53,020 --> 00:38:51,650
disabled my webcam that's Larry laters

843
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:53,030
they thought well maybe my son doesn't

844
00:38:56,290 --> 00:38:54,290
really know and he said I would

845
00:38:58,000 --> 00:38:56,300
absolutely cover it up and he said your

846
00:39:02,440 --> 00:38:58,010
phone can be taking pictures of you even

847
00:39:06,099 --> 00:39:02,450
when it's off watch he said yep the

848
00:39:08,710 --> 00:39:06,109
technology exists for your phone to be

849
00:39:11,859 --> 00:39:08,720
taking video and pictures of you even

850
00:39:14,470 --> 00:39:11,869
when it's powered down and when it's on

851
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:14,480
you know it's even worse and to try to

852
00:39:20,470 --> 00:39:17,330
avoid tracking things like location in

853
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:20,480
our location trackers for maps and stuff

854
00:39:24,730 --> 00:39:23,090
like that and any told me you know on

855
00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:24,740
Facebook there are certain things you

856
00:39:27,970 --> 00:39:26,570
can do to go into your settings and

857
00:39:31,750 --> 00:39:27,980
you'll find out that you've got all

858
00:39:34,150 --> 00:39:31,760
kinds of open apps and open windows that

859
00:39:36,690 --> 00:39:34,160
anybody could get into and I really I

860
00:39:39,870 --> 00:39:36,700
have been hacked like nobody's business

861
00:39:43,090 --> 00:39:39,880
and that was really scary

862
00:39:44,859 --> 00:39:43,100
so you know people are naive if you

863
00:39:47,140 --> 00:39:44,869
think just because you turn off your

864
00:39:48,730 --> 00:39:47,150
computer you turn off your cell phone or

865
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:48,740
you know there isn't a satellite

866
00:39:53,230 --> 00:39:51,170
overhead at the exact moment that nobody

867
00:39:56,710 --> 00:39:53,240
can see what you're doing you're wrong

868
00:39:58,780 --> 00:39:56,720
but the plus side of that is it

869
00:40:00,700 --> 00:39:58,790
unless you're doing something really bad

870
00:40:01,180 --> 00:40:00,710
nobody really gives a crap what you're

871
00:40:05,710 --> 00:40:01,190
doing

872
00:40:08,559 --> 00:40:05,720
so the sheer amount of data that has to

873
00:40:10,180 --> 00:40:08,569
be looked through you know NSA has

874
00:40:12,910 --> 00:40:10,190
facilities where they're literally

875
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:12,920
looking through billions and billions

876
00:40:17,079 --> 00:40:14,930
and billions of bits of information and

877
00:40:20,050 --> 00:40:17,089
it's done by computer can't possibly be

878
00:40:22,809 --> 00:40:20,060
done by humans well they're only tagging

879
00:40:25,900 --> 00:40:22,819
a very small percentage of that

880
00:40:27,609 --> 00:40:25,910
information and obviously you know

881
00:40:31,120 --> 00:40:27,619
anything they think that might be terror

882
00:40:36,700 --> 00:40:31,130
related or overturning the government or

883
00:40:38,410 --> 00:40:36,710
you know impressive but as writers you

884
00:40:41,109 --> 00:40:38,420
know we're doing Google searches for

885
00:40:41,950 --> 00:40:41,119
serial killers how do you shoot somebody

886
00:40:44,620 --> 00:40:41,960
with a rifle

887
00:40:47,470 --> 00:40:44,630
yeah and it's so funny cuz this brighter

888
00:40:49,300 --> 00:40:47,480
we're probably like on the list but then

889
00:40:52,630 --> 00:40:49,310
as soon as they find out we're right so

890
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:52,640
I go check moving he's right but yeah

891
00:40:58,210 --> 00:40:55,490
it's really scary and they now have

892
00:41:00,819 --> 00:40:58,220
drone and satellite technology that can

893
00:41:03,460 --> 00:41:00,829
look through walls liquor ceilings yeah

894
00:41:07,690 --> 00:41:03,470
but again you know most of us are not

895
00:41:10,030 --> 00:41:07,700
doing anything that would attract any

896
00:41:11,890 --> 00:41:10,040
attention and yet it's still there I

897
00:41:14,140 --> 00:41:11,900
remember seeing a picture of somebody

898
00:41:16,750 --> 00:41:14,150
with in England and they were walking

899
00:41:19,089 --> 00:41:16,760
down a street one Street in London just

900
00:41:22,089 --> 00:41:19,099
pointing to all of the cameras that were

901
00:41:24,220 --> 00:41:22,099
you know atop buildings just watching

902
00:41:28,300 --> 00:41:24,230
the public and it was absolutely

903
00:41:31,990 --> 00:41:28,310
astounding Wow yeah that's terrifying to

904
00:41:37,210 --> 00:41:32,000
think of it is but you know cooking up a

905
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:37,220
bomb in your house okay you're probably

906
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:39,050
okay but then you know we always run

907
00:41:44,890 --> 00:41:41,890
that risk Murray of where does security

908
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:44,900
begin and where does invasion of Primus

909
00:41:53,970 --> 00:41:49,930
privacy end you know yeah you know the

910
00:41:55,870 --> 00:41:53,980
what the Patriot Act really right really

911
00:41:58,900 --> 00:41:55,880
destroyed a lot of our civil liberties

912
00:42:00,970 --> 00:41:58,910
and destroyed our privacy rights and the

913
00:42:02,710 --> 00:42:00,980
funny thing is is that after certain

914
00:42:04,839 --> 00:42:02,720
amount of time passed people thought

915
00:42:06,670 --> 00:42:04,849
that the Patriot Act would go away and

916
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:06,680
it's actually only been strengthened

917
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:08,570
right right

918
00:42:12,250 --> 00:42:10,130
you know and they'll say oh well we got

919
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:12,260
to keep track of Isis but their domestic

920
00:42:16,060 --> 00:42:13,970
domestic surveillance and domestic

921
00:42:18,790 --> 00:42:16,070
spying is a huge part of what's being

922
00:42:21,220 --> 00:42:18,800
done and I remember reading a few years

923
00:42:23,140 --> 00:42:21,230
ago that one of the number-one targets

924
00:42:25,780 --> 00:42:23,150
of domestic spying is animal rights

925
00:42:31,030 --> 00:42:25,790
organizations can you explain that to me

926
00:42:32,260 --> 00:42:31,040
interesting I used to be in a very after

927
00:42:34,240 --> 00:42:32,270
you've ever heard about the Animal

928
00:42:38,050 --> 00:42:34,250
Liberation Front this is a long time ago

929
00:42:40,630 --> 00:42:38,060
but you know we we broke into labs and

930
00:42:42,250 --> 00:42:40,640
got animals out at statute of

931
00:42:48,610 --> 00:42:42,260
limitations is passed so they can't

932
00:42:50,500 --> 00:42:48,620
really commission if you if you are a

933
00:42:51,910 --> 00:42:50,510
terrorist yeah you're a target but

934
00:42:54,220 --> 00:42:51,920
they're they're even more concerned

935
00:42:57,670 --> 00:42:54,230
about people that might disrupt Big

936
00:42:59,590 --> 00:42:57,680
Pharma and big agribusiness they're

937
00:43:02,500 --> 00:42:59,600
concerned more about people that might

938
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:02,510
have the goods on a dow or a Monsanto

939
00:43:08,230 --> 00:43:05,930
then they are this guy's got a kick gosh

940
00:43:09,910 --> 00:43:08,240
I have 500 guns and a book about you

941
00:43:13,630 --> 00:43:09,920
know how to blow up your neighbor this

942
00:43:16,540 --> 00:43:13,640
is really odd what the priorities are

943
00:43:20,500 --> 00:43:16,550
yeah I can't even imagine what the red

944
00:43:22,300 --> 00:43:20,510
flags look like yeah you know animal

945
00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:22,310
rights I mean come on now today I don't

946
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:23,930
know it could be a little bit different

947
00:43:28,690 --> 00:43:25,850
but that was that was about maybe ten

948
00:43:30,850 --> 00:43:28,700
years ago but that was the public enemy

949
00:43:33,340 --> 00:43:30,860
number one on their list of domestic

950
00:43:36,250 --> 00:43:33,350
surveillance Wow blew me away

951
00:43:38,890 --> 00:43:36,260
give me a break yeah you know as our

952
00:43:40,720 --> 00:43:38,900
technology increases the means by which

953
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:40,730
they can watch us are gonna become more

954
00:43:45,990 --> 00:43:44,090
sophisticated talk about ships people

955
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:46,000
talk about and this is still conspiracy

956
00:43:52,420 --> 00:43:49,370
you know but people talk about this push

957
00:43:54,790 --> 00:43:52,430
for vaccinations could possibly be to

958
00:43:56,890 --> 00:43:54,800
chip us and what better way to watch us

959
00:44:00,400 --> 00:43:56,900
then in something that is in our own

960
00:44:03,660 --> 00:44:00,410
bodies it's creepy to think about it's

961
00:44:07,300 --> 00:44:03,670
makes for a good movie you know or novel

962
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:07,310
but you know that that's not out of the

963
00:44:13,330 --> 00:44:10,490
question because that technology exists

964
00:44:15,790 --> 00:44:13,340
and it's getting littler I mean RF IDs

965
00:44:18,610 --> 00:44:15,800
the tags and yeah they're getting so

966
00:44:21,490 --> 00:44:18,620
tiny that you might think it's just you

967
00:44:22,180 --> 00:44:21,500
know a little speck of salt from your

968
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:22,190
leftover

969
00:44:28,630 --> 00:44:24,530
lunch and I realize that somebody's

970
00:44:31,870 --> 00:44:28,640
looking at you yeah yeah it's scary am i

971
00:44:34,330 --> 00:44:31,880
looking over my shoulder now no but we

972
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:34,340
can't live like I mean really the best

973
00:44:38,350 --> 00:44:36,170
that we can do is try to clean up the

974
00:44:40,270 --> 00:44:38,360
things we can write you know his son

975
00:44:42,220 --> 00:44:40,280
take your location tracker off your

976
00:44:44,950 --> 00:44:42,230
phone mom you don't need that you know

977
00:44:47,530 --> 00:44:44,960
is do the little things you know watch

978
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:47,540
all your security settings and stuff on

979
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:49,850
Facebook and Twitter and when you buy

980
00:44:53,830 --> 00:44:51,890
something online oh please make sure

981
00:44:55,300 --> 00:44:53,840
it's a secured site and even then you

982
00:44:57,820 --> 00:44:55,310
know you're kind of you're not really

983
00:44:59,800 --> 00:44:57,830
how to percent safe but just common

984
00:45:01,540 --> 00:44:59,810
sense but when it comes to going outside

985
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:01,550
your home or you know sitting watching

986
00:45:07,870 --> 00:45:05,530
TV there may be a draft on there maybe a

987
00:45:09,490 --> 00:45:07,880
satellite overhead but if I you're doing

988
00:45:11,290 --> 00:45:09,500
is sitting and watching TV and that

989
00:45:13,870 --> 00:45:11,300
satellite is overhead for a nanosecond

990
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:13,880
yeah big deal you gonna do you can't

991
00:45:19,060 --> 00:45:16,570
really fight right you should be good

992
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:19,070
although there yeah there are some laws

993
00:45:22,180 --> 00:45:20,450
on the books now that you should you

994
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:22,190
have the right shoe

995
00:45:25,930 --> 00:45:23,690
well we're pushing the right to shoot

996
00:45:27,940 --> 00:45:25,940
down a drone that is on your private

997
00:45:31,150 --> 00:45:27,950
property and I will be the first one to

998
00:45:33,820 --> 00:45:31,160
sign oh wow that's very interesting I I

999
00:45:35,410 --> 00:45:33,830
read today that you know we're even

1000
00:45:38,020 --> 00:45:35,420
getting to the point where I think it

1001
00:45:41,530 --> 00:45:38,030
was at the University of Florida they

1002
00:45:44,890 --> 00:45:41,540
are testing mind controlled drones where

1003
00:45:48,940 --> 00:45:44,900
these people are able to pilot these

1004
00:45:51,250 --> 00:45:48,950
drones using brain waves which you know

1005
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:51,260
brain computer interface it's absolutely

1006
00:45:56,170 --> 00:45:53,410
astounding it's exciting in terms of

1007
00:45:58,480 --> 00:45:56,180
technology right it is the future but in

1008
00:46:01,240 --> 00:45:58,490
turn then you you wonder what that

1009
00:46:04,630 --> 00:46:01,250
technology will be used for and that's

1010
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:04,640
that can be a scary thing yeah like you

1011
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:06,890
said as long as we're careful and you

1012
00:46:14,980 --> 00:46:10,490
know we live our lives and we use common

1013
00:46:19,870 --> 00:46:14,990
sense then we should be okay well if it

1014
00:46:22,150 --> 00:46:19,880
really makes you you know yeah I think

1015
00:46:23,230 --> 00:46:22,160
probably the most powerful weapon we

1016
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:23,240
have is knowledge

1017
00:46:27,550 --> 00:46:25,610
yeah and whether you read my book or

1018
00:46:30,760 --> 00:46:27,560
anybody else's or listen to your radio

1019
00:46:34,460 --> 00:46:30,770
show and you become aware you know tell

1020
00:46:36,530 --> 00:46:34,470
somebody else you're and the level race

1021
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:36,540
that level of awareness alone is a

1022
00:46:42,290 --> 00:46:40,410
danger to the status quo because the

1023
00:46:44,859 --> 00:46:42,300
more people that become aware the more

1024
00:46:47,750 --> 00:46:44,869
angry they become and then you get

1025
00:46:54,950 --> 00:46:47,760
little things like revolutions happens

1026
00:46:59,290 --> 00:46:54,960
are usually I was a good Maria why do

1027
00:47:02,650 --> 00:46:59,300
well when it's get a little lighter tone

1028
00:47:04,849 --> 00:47:02,660
talk about some of your articles I

1029
00:47:07,430 --> 00:47:04,859
recently started working with you over

1030
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:07,440
at the paranormal brain trust Jim Harold

1031
00:47:14,810 --> 00:47:09,690
calm for those of you who may not be

1032
00:47:16,670 --> 00:47:14,820
familiar and I read your first article

1033
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:16,680
and it literally left me saying aloud

1034
00:47:22,490 --> 00:47:18,690
wow I have never thought about that

1035
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:22,500
before I forgot what it was this was

1036
00:47:27,349 --> 00:47:24,810
your article titled is a house is a

1037
00:47:29,810 --> 00:47:27,359
haunted house really haunted if there's

1038
00:47:35,390 --> 00:47:29,820
no one there to see it see the haunting

1039
00:47:37,070 --> 00:47:35,400
I totally botched that I apologize it's

1040
00:47:40,070 --> 00:47:37,080
basically you know if a tree falls in

1041
00:47:41,690 --> 00:47:40,080
the forest can you give us a glimpse of

1042
00:47:44,089 --> 00:47:41,700
this article what you discovered in

1043
00:47:47,599 --> 00:47:44,099
terms of I know you spoke of quantum

1044
00:47:49,490 --> 00:47:47,609
physics and meditation so tell us is can

1045
00:47:51,770 --> 00:47:49,500
a house be haunted if there's no one

1046
00:47:53,630 --> 00:47:51,780
there to experience it well we don't

1047
00:47:58,160 --> 00:47:53,640
know for sure because it's absolutely

1048
00:47:59,990 --> 00:47:58,170
impossible to prove but if you know the

1049
00:48:02,630 --> 00:48:00,000
reason why I wrote that is because I

1050
00:48:05,750 --> 00:48:02,640
really am fascinated with quantum in

1051
00:48:08,510 --> 00:48:05,760
theoretical physics because the world of

1052
00:48:10,070 --> 00:48:08,520
the subatomic particle is even more

1053
00:48:12,710 --> 00:48:10,080
paranormal than anything in the

1054
00:48:14,870 --> 00:48:12,720
paranormal field and even though we

1055
00:48:16,460 --> 00:48:14,880
haven't proven yet that anything we

1056
00:48:18,950 --> 00:48:16,470
learn about what happens on the quantum

1057
00:48:21,890 --> 00:48:18,960
level can be extrapolated to the cosmic

1058
00:48:25,520 --> 00:48:21,900
level quote-unquote it's still really

1059
00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:25,530
cool to think about and maybe it can so

1060
00:48:30,500 --> 00:48:28,050
the idea being that there's this thing

1061
00:48:32,750 --> 00:48:30,510
called the observer effect and in the

1062
00:48:36,230 --> 00:48:32,760
world of the quantum the active

1063
00:48:39,020 --> 00:48:36,240
observation has the ability to change

1064
00:48:41,329 --> 00:48:39,030
the behavior or the actions of subatomic

1065
00:48:43,790 --> 00:48:41,339
particle and there have been experiments

1066
00:48:45,859 --> 00:48:43,800
approved with that and so how I wanted

1067
00:48:46,750 --> 00:48:45,869
to look at that with with the paranormal

1068
00:48:49,540 --> 00:48:46,760
is

1069
00:48:53,190 --> 00:48:49,550
if that's true and we are acting as the

1070
00:48:57,550 --> 00:48:53,200
observers and we are responsible for

1071
00:48:58,240 --> 00:48:57,560
fixing certain things into a reality if

1072
00:49:00,460 --> 00:48:58,250
you will

1073
00:49:02,740 --> 00:49:00,470
are we perceiving our reality as we go

1074
00:49:06,670 --> 00:49:02,750
along are we creating it does that mean

1075
00:49:10,540 --> 00:49:06,680
anything outside of of us doesn't exist

1076
00:49:12,250 --> 00:49:10,550
until somehow we observe it into reality

1077
00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:12,260
and you know you go down that rabbit

1078
00:49:18,880 --> 00:49:15,290
hole so say there's a house that people

1079
00:49:23,080 --> 00:49:18,890
say is haunted it is it only haunted

1080
00:49:26,170 --> 00:49:23,090
when there is an observer present to see

1081
00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:26,180
that particular unfoldment of of the

1082
00:49:32,290 --> 00:49:29,450
activity and when that observer is not

1083
00:49:34,840 --> 00:49:32,300
there everything exists in US or the

1084
00:49:36,490 --> 00:49:34,850
state of superposition as it does in the

1085
00:49:41,380 --> 00:49:36,500
quantum world when there's no observer

1086
00:49:43,750 --> 00:49:41,390
is that true you know can we maybe apply

1087
00:49:47,620 --> 00:49:43,760
that theory to the grander scale of

1088
00:49:49,900 --> 00:49:47,630
reality does you know in any house so

1089
00:49:52,150 --> 00:49:49,910
that somebody says is haunted where do

1090
00:49:53,020 --> 00:49:52,160
you make that decision because somebody

1091
00:49:55,240 --> 00:49:53,030
saw something

1092
00:49:57,640 --> 00:49:55,250
because somebody experienced something

1093
00:50:01,540 --> 00:49:57,650
because somebody observed something

1094
00:50:03,370 --> 00:50:01,550
remove any possible observer and I'm not

1095
00:50:07,390 --> 00:50:03,380
just talking about a human being I'm

1096
00:50:10,380 --> 00:50:07,400
talking cameras tape recorders because

1097
00:50:14,100 --> 00:50:10,390
an an observer is nothing more than a

1098
00:50:17,410 --> 00:50:14,110
person or device that measures something

1099
00:50:19,930 --> 00:50:17,420
okay that's what an observer is it can

1100
00:50:22,030 --> 00:50:19,940
measure you know what's going on audibly

1101
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:22,040
what's going on visually it can be a

1102
00:50:27,070 --> 00:50:23,930
person it can be a dog it can be chat

1103
00:50:29,740 --> 00:50:27,080
whatever if there's no observer there is

1104
00:50:31,900 --> 00:50:29,750
it just is nothing happening or is

1105
00:50:34,180 --> 00:50:31,910
everything happening and it takes that

1106
00:50:36,370 --> 00:50:34,190
observer to come in and fix everything

1107
00:50:38,770 --> 00:50:36,380
into a position whereby you can then

1108
00:50:40,930 --> 00:50:38,780
perceive it and the problem with that is

1109
00:50:42,790 --> 00:50:40,940
an egg Larry nice careless crazy we're

1110
00:50:48,520 --> 00:50:42,800
having these conversations like how can

1111
00:50:52,020 --> 00:50:48,530
we test this how do you how do you

1112
00:50:54,850 --> 00:50:52,030
observer an unobservable haunted house

1113
00:50:57,100 --> 00:50:54,860
and that's what's so frustrating about

1114
00:50:58,510 --> 00:50:57,110
physics and getting into the quantum

1115
00:51:00,610 --> 00:50:58,520
world is that

1116
00:51:02,230 --> 00:51:00,620
you a lot of it are a lot of these

1117
00:51:04,060 --> 00:51:02,240
experiments like Schrodinger's cat

1118
00:51:08,530 --> 00:51:04,070
experiment they're thought experiments

1119
00:51:10,960 --> 00:51:08,540
you can't actually do you open that box

1120
00:51:13,060 --> 00:51:10,970
you know you're observing a particular

1121
00:51:16,090 --> 00:51:13,070
reality mm-hmm so and that's always

1122
00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:16,100
really blowing my mind I tend to lean

1123
00:51:23,350 --> 00:51:19,610
towards the fact that we as observers

1124
00:51:25,900 --> 00:51:23,360
are Co responsible maybe it's the word

1125
00:51:28,480 --> 00:51:25,910
for the manifestation of paranormal

1126
00:51:30,370 --> 00:51:28,490
phenomena I have always believed that in

1127
00:51:31,930 --> 00:51:30,380
other words I believe and Larry and I

1128
00:51:34,510 --> 00:51:31,940
wrote a book called the grid that is all

1129
00:51:37,420 --> 00:51:34,520
about this that there are external

1130
00:51:39,970 --> 00:51:37,430
environmental influences interacting

1131
00:51:42,100 --> 00:51:39,980
with internal physiological influences

1132
00:51:43,900 --> 00:51:42,110
that create paranormal phenomena and

1133
00:51:46,030 --> 00:51:43,910
that is what one person can experience

1134
00:51:49,510 --> 00:51:46,040
something and the person standing next

1135
00:51:51,580 --> 00:51:49,520
to them doesn't because their internal

1136
00:51:54,670 --> 00:51:51,590
their physiological nature may not be

1137
00:51:56,110 --> 00:51:54,680
the same to trigger that interaction

1138
00:51:58,330 --> 00:51:56,120
with the environmental external

1139
00:52:02,650 --> 00:51:58,340
influences that the person next to them

1140
00:52:04,630 --> 00:52:02,660
does and and again you know if neither

1141
00:52:06,550 --> 00:52:04,640
of those people are in there is there

1142
00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:06,560
still stuff going on or is everything

1143
00:52:11,220 --> 00:52:09,290
happening or nothing and I just really

1144
00:52:14,980 --> 00:52:11,230
tend to lean on from what I've learned

1145
00:52:18,400 --> 00:52:14,990
that a haunted house is is just a void

1146
00:52:20,290 --> 00:52:18,410
of activity until somebody comes in and

1147
00:52:21,970 --> 00:52:20,300
observes something but at the same time

1148
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:21,980
that can mean that everything possible

1149
00:52:27,100 --> 00:52:24,410
is occurring as well that's one of the

1150
00:52:29,110 --> 00:52:27,110
dilemmas of one visits right is that

1151
00:52:31,870 --> 00:52:29,120
everything is either happening or

1152
00:52:35,200 --> 00:52:31,880
nothing is happen yeah theories yeah I

1153
00:52:36,700 --> 00:52:35,210
know hates the observer even if

1154
00:52:38,770 --> 00:52:36,710
everything is happening in that house

1155
00:52:40,930 --> 00:52:38,780
awesome you still have to have an act of

1156
00:52:42,940 --> 00:52:40,940
observation to come in

1157
00:52:45,460 --> 00:52:42,950
it's called collapsing the wavefunction

1158
00:52:48,370 --> 00:52:45,470
so we know that there's no such thing as

1159
00:52:51,190 --> 00:52:48,380
a particle particles can exist as both

1160
00:52:56,050 --> 00:52:51,200
particles and waves and they behave as

1161
00:52:59,410 --> 00:52:56,060
waves until you have an observer step in

1162
00:53:02,800 --> 00:52:59,420
and collapse that wavefunction giving

1163
00:53:04,120 --> 00:53:02,810
you a fixed particle okay it tells you

1164
00:53:05,830 --> 00:53:04,130
exactly what the momentum of the

1165
00:53:07,090 --> 00:53:05,840
particle is or where the position is but

1166
00:53:09,070 --> 00:53:07,100
you can't have that

1167
00:53:12,010 --> 00:53:09,080
without some act of measurement or

1168
00:53:12,339 --> 00:53:12,020
observation so you walk into a haunted

1169
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:12,349
house

1170
00:53:18,479 --> 00:53:14,690
where everything is going on it's just a

1171
00:53:20,410 --> 00:53:18,489
blur of you know virtual quantum

1172
00:53:22,599 --> 00:53:20,420
particles popping in and out of

1173
00:53:26,170 --> 00:53:22,609
existence it would take an act of

1174
00:53:28,239 --> 00:53:26,180
observation to fix all of that into one

1175
00:53:31,299 --> 00:53:28,249
particular outcome which might be an

1176
00:53:32,739 --> 00:53:31,309
apparition across the hall and yeah I'm

1177
00:53:36,069 --> 00:53:32,749
gonna get this really just some heavy

1178
00:53:39,339 --> 00:53:36,079
stuff and it's totally speculative right

1179
00:53:41,349 --> 00:53:39,349
right I mean but very it's it it's a

1180
00:53:43,539 --> 00:53:41,359
very interesting theory you know I could

1181
00:53:44,979 --> 00:53:43,549
even sort of relate it to the stone tape

1182
00:53:48,339 --> 00:53:44,989
theory you know the fact that these

1183
00:53:51,099 --> 00:53:48,349
things could be on replay constantly and

1184
00:53:54,190 --> 00:53:51,109
then like you said it takes that that

1185
00:53:57,910 --> 00:53:54,200
observer and their perception of what is

1186
00:54:01,269 --> 00:53:57,920
going on to to break as you said those

1187
00:54:07,089 --> 00:54:01,279
waves and should manifest the apparition

1188
00:54:09,039 --> 00:54:07,099
manifest appear exactly yeah I mean if

1189
00:54:13,239 --> 00:54:09,049
you have say you have walls that

1190
00:54:15,940 --> 00:54:13,249
supposedly are have encapsulated energy

1191
00:54:18,579 --> 00:54:15,950
from a past event or whatever and it's

1192
00:54:21,370 --> 00:54:18,589
looping it in in this particular room

1193
00:54:22,779 --> 00:54:21,380
there's just constant loop and also

1194
00:54:24,459 --> 00:54:22,789
probably a whole lot of other stuff

1195
00:54:27,489 --> 00:54:24,469
going on over the course of the history

1196
00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:27,499
of that house and it's all energy it's

1197
00:54:34,209 --> 00:54:30,729
all frequency vibration nothing is fixed

1198
00:54:37,870 --> 00:54:34,219
and you walk into that room and you

1199
00:54:41,499 --> 00:54:37,880
maybe you will collapse the wave

1200
00:54:44,769 --> 00:54:41,509
function and observe an apparition but I

1201
00:54:46,390 --> 00:54:44,779
might not fix the wave function and say

1202
00:54:49,150 --> 00:54:46,400
Ryan you're crazy

1203
00:54:50,859 --> 00:54:49,160
there's nothing here or there's a cat

1204
00:54:53,319 --> 00:54:50,869
you know that you might have and that's

1205
00:54:57,059 --> 00:54:53,329
what's so cool is it it's not Jed this

1206
00:54:59,829 --> 00:54:57,069
is not just external phenomena it's us

1207
00:55:02,319 --> 00:54:59,839
we're interacting with it and if we

1208
00:55:04,359 --> 00:55:02,329
don't figure out what it is in our

1209
00:55:07,979 --> 00:55:04,369
physiology or a consciousness or

1210
00:55:11,739 --> 00:55:07,989
whatever that is triggering it

1211
00:55:14,259 --> 00:55:11,749
manifesting it perceiving it and why the

1212
00:55:15,819 --> 00:55:14,269
guy next to us is totally clueless I

1213
00:55:18,190 --> 00:55:15,829
don't think we're ever really gonna

1214
00:55:21,039 --> 00:55:18,200
understand the paranormal fully great

1215
00:55:24,489 --> 00:55:21,049
point I mean that's my soapbox oh no

1216
00:55:25,900 --> 00:55:24,499
it's it's an extremely educated soapbox

1217
00:55:27,670 --> 00:55:25,910
one I

1218
00:55:31,510 --> 00:55:27,680
I definitely want to be up there with

1219
00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:31,520
you for sure Murray that was probably my

1220
00:55:35,140 --> 00:55:33,530
favorite article over Jim Harold so I

1221
00:55:39,070 --> 00:55:35,150
want to I wanted to applaud you on that

1222
00:55:41,380 --> 00:55:39,080
it's let's talk about it you know I

1223
00:55:45,220 --> 00:55:41,390
wasn't bringing it up please

1224
00:55:49,480 --> 00:55:45,230
I I could not read the article because

1225
00:55:52,360 --> 00:55:49,490
like many obeah yes I suffered this when

1226
00:55:54,070 --> 00:55:52,370
I was a young child and it was very

1227
00:55:58,870 --> 00:55:54,080
traumatizing could you give us a little

1228
00:56:00,910 --> 00:55:58,880
info on I just I hate clowns and I have

1229
00:56:04,090 --> 00:56:00,920
a friend on Facebook that we're always

1230
00:56:06,370 --> 00:56:04,100
teasing each other over our dismay at

1231
00:56:10,990 --> 00:56:06,380
the clowns world I just thought you know

1232
00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:11,000
everyone oh I don't know anybody oh yeah

1233
00:56:16,750 --> 00:56:14,330
what is the I don't know I just thought

1234
00:56:18,640 --> 00:56:16,760
you know what Jim was like yeah go for

1235
00:56:21,250 --> 00:56:18,650
it sounds fascinating I wanted to look

1236
00:56:23,920 --> 00:56:21,260
at you know the history of clowns and

1237
00:56:25,060 --> 00:56:23,930
where did they start how do they what

1238
00:56:26,770 --> 00:56:25,070
what were they supposed to be

1239
00:56:28,720 --> 00:56:26,780
entertaining and and that were they

1240
00:56:31,690 --> 00:56:28,730
tragic and they really were a comedy

1241
00:56:34,750 --> 00:56:31,700
issued of the two now they evolved quite

1242
00:56:37,090 --> 00:56:34,760
recently into the more sinister evil

1243
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:37,100
clowns that we see in America and were

1244
00:56:44,740 --> 00:56:41,810
story in it but yeah it's funny because

1245
00:56:48,430 --> 00:56:44,750
the vast majority of people don't like

1246
00:56:51,850 --> 00:56:48,440
clowns and the reason being that a clown

1247
00:56:53,860 --> 00:56:51,860
is has a mask clown is wearing a mask to

1248
00:56:56,260 --> 00:56:53,870
hide their true identity we have a

1249
00:56:58,750 --> 00:56:56,270
disturbance mistrust of that from

1250
00:57:01,240 --> 00:56:58,760
childhood that's why a lot of not only

1251
00:57:04,120 --> 00:57:01,250
that but oftentimes that costume that

1252
00:57:06,670 --> 00:57:04,130
makeup is very garish yeah so as

1253
00:57:09,250 --> 00:57:06,680
children it freaks us out you know I

1254
00:57:11,830 --> 00:57:09,260
mean even both of the clown or Ronald

1255
00:57:13,390 --> 00:57:11,840
McDonald they're pretty mild compared to

1256
00:57:15,910 --> 00:57:13,400
some of the others but they're still

1257
00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:15,920
they they serve trigger something in our

1258
00:57:20,320 --> 00:57:18,170
subconscious we don't trust them because

1259
00:57:24,130 --> 00:57:20,330
they're hiding behind a mask of makeup

1260
00:57:27,220 --> 00:57:24,140
and the wig and the crazy costumes and

1261
00:57:29,290 --> 00:57:27,230
then over time you know one person comes

1262
00:57:31,650 --> 00:57:29,300
up with a sinister clown idea and it

1263
00:57:34,510 --> 00:57:31,660
just exploded in our pop culture

1264
00:57:36,580 --> 00:57:34,520
basically because we all relate you know

1265
00:57:39,589 --> 00:57:36,590
killer clowns from outer spaces are

1266
00:57:42,469 --> 00:57:39,599
really cool it really is

1267
00:57:44,420 --> 00:57:42,479
yeah it's it's a part of our history in

1268
00:57:47,449 --> 00:57:44,430
our pop culture that everybody can

1269
00:57:49,130 --> 00:57:47,459
relate to because honestly I also but

1270
00:57:50,499 --> 00:57:49,140
the way I think I ended the article

1271
00:57:53,420 --> 00:57:50,509
talking about how there are these

1272
00:57:54,829 --> 00:57:53,430
therapy clowns and they work with kids

1273
00:57:58,479 --> 00:57:54,839
and I'm thinking wait a minute you just

1274
00:58:00,890 --> 00:57:58,489
got through telling me clowns but

1275
00:58:03,499 --> 00:58:00,900
apparently you know if they're if they

1276
00:58:05,959 --> 00:58:03,509
look a certain way and they're more open

1277
00:58:08,359 --> 00:58:05,969
and friendly and they're not as garish

1278
00:58:10,279 --> 00:58:08,369
they're not a spooky-looking that really

1279
00:58:12,130 --> 00:58:10,289
is a wonderful way to interact with kids

1280
00:58:14,779 --> 00:58:12,140
with autism and developmental

1281
00:58:16,729 --> 00:58:14,789
disabilities where they respond to the

1282
00:58:19,699 --> 00:58:16,739
humor and the exaggerated facial

1283
00:58:22,069 --> 00:58:19,709
expressions and the props and jokes and

1284
00:58:24,140 --> 00:58:22,079
stuff so there is a little side to

1285
00:58:28,549 --> 00:58:24,150
clowns that is positive mm-hmm

1286
00:58:31,160 --> 00:58:28,559
I'm glad there's still hope you

1287
00:58:32,719 --> 00:58:31,170
mentioned pop culture Murray um I wanted

1288
00:58:36,170 --> 00:58:32,729
to touch on another one of your articles

1289
00:58:39,319 --> 00:58:36,180
of folklore which you titled

1290
00:58:42,049 --> 00:58:39,329
dubbed fake lore this was very

1291
00:58:43,939 --> 00:58:42,059
interesting the rake Slenderman

1292
00:58:46,309 --> 00:58:43,949
we have black-eyed children things like

1293
00:58:50,329 --> 00:58:46,319
this Jeff the killer oral tradition has

1294
00:58:51,859 --> 00:58:50,339
played such a powerful role in the

1295
00:58:55,249 --> 00:58:51,869
topics that you and I are very

1296
00:58:58,609 --> 00:58:55,259
interested in we are the ones trying to

1297
00:59:00,439 --> 00:58:58,619
delineate you know fact and fiction so

1298
00:59:02,959 --> 00:59:00,449
what sort of prompted you to write this

1299
00:59:05,120 --> 00:59:02,969
article and are there any urban legend

1300
00:59:09,319 --> 00:59:05,130
as it were that you think there could be

1301
00:59:11,689 --> 00:59:09,329
a reality behind oh gosh I just I love

1302
00:59:14,930 --> 00:59:11,699
this kind of stuff you know I love pop

1303
00:59:19,489 --> 00:59:14,940
culture and I also love the idea that

1304
00:59:21,739 --> 00:59:19,499
the collective unconscious can create to

1305
00:59:24,439 --> 00:59:21,749
actually create these some of these

1306
00:59:27,739 --> 00:59:24,449
entities if you have enough people that

1307
00:59:29,329 --> 00:59:27,749
believe in something can it can it come

1308
00:59:32,870 --> 00:59:29,339
true or can it be manifested into

1309
00:59:35,900 --> 00:59:32,880
reality so what's really with there's

1310
00:59:38,089 --> 00:59:35,910
folklore and folklore has a lot of truth

1311
00:59:39,949 --> 00:59:38,099
to it but it's embedded and fiction it's

1312
00:59:42,019 --> 00:59:39,959
an embedded and exaggeration and

1313
00:59:43,729 --> 00:59:42,029
embellishment but there is truth to

1314
00:59:45,829 --> 00:59:43,739
folklore just as there are some truths

1315
00:59:47,989 --> 00:59:45,839
to miss and some truth to legend

1316
00:59:50,150 --> 00:59:47,999
all of those things have it their core

1317
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:50,160
truths they couldn't have been about

1318
00:59:53,870 --> 00:59:51,930
real people or real events but by the

1319
00:59:56,029 --> 00:59:53,880
time you layer it all the embellishment

1320
00:59:58,069 --> 00:59:56,039
it's really hard to tell what's what and

1321
01:00:00,829 --> 00:59:58,079
well now with the internet we have this

1322
01:00:03,380 --> 01:00:00,839
new thing called fake lore which is

1323
01:00:07,789 --> 01:00:03,390
basically you know these these websites

1324
01:00:10,219 --> 01:00:07,799
like creepypasta Ana where people submit

1325
01:00:14,449 --> 01:00:10,229
stories they're just fictional stories

1326
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:14,459
and that's made very clear but they take

1327
01:00:20,029 --> 01:00:16,890
on a life of their own

1328
01:00:22,400 --> 01:00:20,039
to the point where as with the Slender

1329
01:00:25,999 --> 01:00:22,410
Man you actually have people committing

1330
01:00:28,489 --> 01:00:26,009
crimes or you know emulating Slenderman

1331
01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:28,499
or this this gala two young girls that

1332
01:00:35,299 --> 01:00:30,690
stabbed their friend because Slenderman

1333
01:00:38,239 --> 01:00:35,309
told them to and these fake totally

1334
01:00:41,660 --> 01:00:38,249
original creative entities start to take

1335
01:00:44,390 --> 01:00:41,670
on this reality with the rake what was

1336
01:00:48,049 --> 01:00:44,400
really funny was it says right there

1337
01:00:49,549 --> 01:00:48,059
this is a fictional entity it kind of

1338
01:00:52,670 --> 01:00:49,559
entered you betcha land I like to call

1339
01:00:55,370 --> 01:00:52,680
IDs after a while people were actually

1340
01:00:58,039 --> 01:00:55,380
recording what they thought were real

1341
01:00:59,120 --> 01:00:58,049
sightings of the rake now granted you

1342
01:01:01,009 --> 01:00:59,130
know what somebody gets in your

1343
01:01:03,739 --> 01:01:01,019
subconscious it's it's real easy to

1344
01:01:05,989 --> 01:01:03,749
misinterpret something else for it but

1345
01:01:08,660 --> 01:01:05,999
it's spooky it's spooky that those kinds

1346
01:01:09,799 --> 01:01:08,670
of things can happen that you can and it

1347
01:01:11,329 --> 01:01:09,809
kind of goes back to what we're talking

1348
01:01:13,729 --> 01:01:11,339
about earlier about media manipulation

1349
01:01:18,349 --> 01:01:13,739
is that you can plant a story online

1350
01:01:20,180 --> 01:01:18,359
that is totally fabricated and you know

1351
01:01:22,699 --> 01:01:20,190
two days later it's all over the world

1352
01:01:25,370 --> 01:01:22,709
and it's being accepted as pure fact I'm

1353
01:01:27,410 --> 01:01:25,380
really was fascinated by that with with

1354
01:01:28,489 --> 01:01:27,420
fake lore also because my son when he

1355
01:01:31,309 --> 01:01:28,499
was younger he used to talk about

1356
01:01:33,859 --> 01:01:31,319
creepypasta all the time I was like what

1357
01:01:35,479 --> 01:01:33,869
the heck is creepypasta what does it

1358
01:01:42,519 --> 01:01:35,489
have to do with with matter I mean I'm

1359
01:01:45,949 --> 01:01:42,529
Italian and he told me and I'm like dude

1360
01:01:48,199 --> 01:01:45,959
some of these stories are oh my god

1361
01:01:50,329 --> 01:01:48,209
they're terrifying yes

1362
01:01:54,109 --> 01:01:50,339
very disturbing yeah and there's other

1363
01:01:56,170 --> 01:01:54,119
sites that really get even creepier but

1364
01:01:59,930 --> 01:01:56,180
you know there's there opportunities for

1365
01:02:03,559 --> 01:01:59,940
writers like us or just people to to be

1366
01:02:05,269 --> 01:02:03,569
creative and oh you know can I come up

1367
01:02:07,140 --> 01:02:05,279
with a really creepy story and freak a

1368
01:02:09,930 --> 01:02:07,150
bunch of people out yeah

1369
01:02:13,080 --> 01:02:09,940
that's the origin of all of this and yet

1370
01:02:15,900 --> 01:02:13,090
the way it's been taken seriously by so

1371
01:02:17,250 --> 01:02:15,910
many people you wonder if there are

1372
01:02:20,190 --> 01:02:17,260
actually people out there that are

1373
01:02:22,140 --> 01:02:20,200
seeing entities that they report to you

1374
01:02:25,020 --> 01:02:22,150
know cryptid hunters and and ghost

1375
01:02:27,900 --> 01:02:25,030
hunters and alien hunters that came from

1376
01:02:31,680 --> 01:02:27,910
the sort of collective unconscious from

1377
01:02:34,830 --> 01:02:31,690
these viral stories so they just

1378
01:02:37,230 --> 01:02:34,840
fascinated me yeah a very broad spectrum

1379
01:02:38,820 --> 01:02:37,240
of topics Ecover there so I definitely

1380
01:02:41,490 --> 01:02:38,830
suggest people check out your work at

1381
01:02:44,250 --> 01:02:41,500
Jim Harold calm I've got a couple

1382
01:02:45,690 --> 01:02:44,260
listener questions I did let people know

1383
01:02:48,810 --> 01:02:45,700
you were coming on and they were very

1384
01:02:54,180 --> 01:02:48,820
excited to ask you some stuff this sort

1385
01:02:56,400 --> 01:02:54,190
of ties in to probably mind Wars but one

1386
01:02:59,160 --> 01:02:56,410
of our listeners asks given the use of

1387
01:02:59,820 --> 01:02:59,170
chemicals being used on civilians in the

1388
01:03:02,220 --> 01:02:59,830
past

1389
01:03:04,200 --> 01:03:02,230
do you believe that this is currently

1390
01:03:06,860 --> 01:03:04,210
happening at the hands of any sort of

1391
01:03:10,980 --> 01:03:06,870
government agency whether it's for

1392
01:03:22,680 --> 01:03:10,990
illnesses or again like we said sort of

1393
01:03:24,960 --> 01:03:22,690
mind control yes okay I'll tell you how

1394
01:03:28,470 --> 01:03:24,970
this came about well first of all again

1395
01:03:31,950 --> 01:03:28,480
my father was a geophysicist he passed

1396
01:03:35,340 --> 01:03:31,960
away for about the last 15 years of his

1397
01:03:38,220 --> 01:03:35,350
professional career as NGO business as

1398
01:03:40,530 --> 01:03:38,230
my father was working on climate science

1399
01:03:42,510 --> 01:03:40,540
and talking a lot about it I'm very well

1400
01:03:44,100 --> 01:03:42,520
educated on the subject and I only say

1401
01:03:46,710 --> 01:03:44,110
that because it's kind of surprising

1402
01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:46,720
with my belief in chemtrails but he also

1403
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:48,370
told me about geoengineering you said

1404
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:50,410
it's been around forever since the 70s

1405
01:03:55,710 --> 01:03:53,770
you know it's the original attempts of

1406
01:04:00,750 --> 01:03:55,720
geoengineering was to alter the weather

1407
01:04:02,460 --> 01:04:00,760
for positive reasons however I think and

1408
01:04:04,410 --> 01:04:02,470
my dad and I were never really able to

1409
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:04,420
have this conversation but over the last

1410
01:04:09,900 --> 01:04:06,850
several years and I've written a lot in

1411
01:04:12,540 --> 01:04:09,910
my fiction I actually have a fictional

1412
01:04:15,810 --> 01:04:12,550
television series that is being looked

1413
01:04:18,780 --> 01:04:15,820
at that is about chemtrails and that's

1414
01:04:21,150 --> 01:04:18,790
all I can say about it they mice when my

1415
01:04:23,849 --> 01:04:21,160
son who's now 15 when he

1416
01:04:26,069 --> 01:04:23,859
a baby so I think was maybe one years

1417
01:04:28,020 --> 01:04:26,079
old cuz I could still hold him I was in

1418
01:04:31,140 --> 01:04:28,030
the backyard in my home here in Southern

1419
01:04:33,029 --> 01:04:31,150
California and I was on the phone and I

1420
01:04:36,029 --> 01:04:33,039
was walking around my back patio holding

1421
01:04:38,130 --> 01:04:36,039
my son and a small plane went over and

1422
01:04:41,279 --> 01:04:38,140
it was spraying and it was spraying

1423
01:04:44,339 --> 01:04:41,289
something and a white sort of mist came

1424
01:04:47,130 --> 01:04:44,349
down to the ground all over my arms all

1425
01:04:49,349 --> 01:04:47,140
over my kid I was like what the heck I

1426
01:04:52,260 --> 01:04:49,359
had no idea about any of this at the

1427
01:04:54,180 --> 01:04:52,270
time went in the house wiped everything

1428
01:04:56,220 --> 01:04:54,190
off just thought you know what they over

1429
01:04:58,829 --> 01:04:56,230
spray because I live in an agricultural

1430
01:05:01,349 --> 01:04:58,839
belt big deal you know I I'm gonna get

1431
01:05:03,450 --> 01:05:01,359
it off me my son was closed so it really

1432
01:05:06,180 --> 01:05:03,460
wasn't on much of him but I'll be damned

1433
01:05:08,430 --> 01:05:06,190
pardon my french if he and I didn't get

1434
01:05:10,589 --> 01:05:08,440
very sick over the next few days not

1435
01:05:12,240 --> 01:05:10,599
only that with like flu-like symptoms

1436
01:05:14,130 --> 01:05:12,250
well not only that but my neighbors did

1437
01:05:16,620 --> 01:05:14,140
a lot of them that I talked to later

1438
01:05:19,109 --> 01:05:16,630
that were outside at the time okay was

1439
01:05:20,970 --> 01:05:19,119
that something's sinister and mentally

1440
01:05:22,980 --> 01:05:20,980
call the human population you know is

1441
01:05:24,420 --> 01:05:22,990
the big conspiracy there is I don't know

1442
01:05:25,920 --> 01:05:24,430
I don't know if they were testing

1443
01:05:27,839 --> 01:05:25,930
something to see if it would make us

1444
01:05:31,680 --> 01:05:27,849
sick I don't know if it was just an over

1445
01:05:34,819 --> 01:05:31,690
spray of the agricultural spring but as

1446
01:05:37,049 --> 01:05:34,829
time went on I was so angry and so

1447
01:05:39,870 --> 01:05:37,059
fascinated that I started to really read

1448
01:05:41,609 --> 01:05:39,880
up on it where I live you should see the

1449
01:05:43,740 --> 01:05:41,619
skies there are some days that are

1450
01:05:45,990 --> 01:05:43,750
perfectly clear there are some days that

1451
01:05:48,420 --> 01:05:46,000
the sky is an absolute checkerboard and

1452
01:05:50,730 --> 01:05:48,430
it's over residential areas there's no

1453
01:05:52,289 --> 01:05:50,740
reason for that right and I know the

1454
01:05:54,720 --> 01:05:52,299
difference between a control on the

1455
01:05:56,910 --> 01:05:54,730
contrail so yes I have an absolute

1456
01:05:58,740 --> 01:05:56,920
believer do I know who is doing yet I

1457
01:05:59,160 --> 01:05:58,750
know I don't think any of us know for

1458
01:06:02,250 --> 01:05:59,170
sure

1459
01:06:04,710 --> 01:06:02,260
it's either the government in my opinion

1460
01:06:06,630 --> 01:06:04,720
it's more likely big agribusiness and I

1461
01:06:09,240 --> 01:06:06,640
think you know there's a lot of

1462
01:06:11,069 --> 01:06:09,250
conspiracy theories yeah do I think that

1463
01:06:12,960 --> 01:06:11,079
there's a chance that it is the

1464
01:06:15,059 --> 01:06:12,970
government related and they are trying

1465
01:06:17,339 --> 01:06:15,069
to stick in the populace absolutely

1466
01:06:20,779 --> 01:06:17,349
because it made me sick and it's a

1467
01:06:23,400 --> 01:06:20,789
subject that I follow very closely and

1468
01:06:27,029 --> 01:06:23,410
absolutely chemical testing has gone on

1469
01:06:30,630 --> 01:06:27,039
in the past in Subway's on small cities

1470
01:06:32,760 --> 01:06:30,640
you know spraying the pesticides you

1471
01:06:34,170 --> 01:06:32,770
name it and it's still going on and

1472
01:06:36,780 --> 01:06:34,180
maybe this is

1473
01:06:38,430 --> 01:06:36,790
their way of testing some kind of agent

1474
01:06:40,380 --> 01:06:38,440
I think it's kind of a stupid way to do

1475
01:06:45,270 --> 01:06:40,390
it it's very visible yeah you could just

1476
01:06:48,300 --> 01:06:45,280
poison the water in the food system but

1477
01:06:51,300 --> 01:06:48,310
there are way too many people with way

1478
01:06:53,190 --> 01:06:51,310
too amazing pictures and stories to tell

1479
01:06:55,770 --> 01:06:53,200
and skin rashes and this that the other

1480
01:06:58,380 --> 01:06:55,780
thing for me to start thinking that

1481
01:07:01,170 --> 01:06:58,390
these are just overshot agricultural

1482
01:07:02,760 --> 01:07:01,180
spraying that's yeah that's a really

1483
01:07:06,440 --> 01:07:02,770
interesting subject and one of my

1484
01:07:10,170 --> 01:07:06,450
favorite mm-hmm you know opens a lot of

1485
01:07:11,460 --> 01:07:10,180
cans of worms for sure think about that

1486
01:07:13,710 --> 01:07:11,470
your government is doing that but

1487
01:07:16,650 --> 01:07:13,720
they've done it good for exactly it just

1488
01:07:17,340 --> 01:07:16,660
to me it's such a visible dumb way to do

1489
01:07:19,560 --> 01:07:17,350
things

1490
01:07:22,260 --> 01:07:19,570
yeah yeah you would think they would

1491
01:07:24,000 --> 01:07:22,270
have more brains than that but as we've

1492
01:07:27,810 --> 01:07:24,010
learned the government is not exactly

1493
01:07:30,480 --> 01:07:27,820
it's like here we have we're in severe

1494
01:07:32,460 --> 01:07:30,490
drought beyond the severe and they have

1495
01:07:34,020 --> 01:07:32,470
done that and I always noticed I always

1496
01:07:35,580 --> 01:07:34,030
watch for the pattern two three days

1497
01:07:37,640 --> 01:07:35,590
later we have a little bit of rain now

1498
01:07:39,570 --> 01:07:37,650
if that's what you're doing it for I

1499
01:07:41,340 --> 01:07:39,580
understand we need to get out of this

1500
01:07:45,090 --> 01:07:41,350
drought but what the hell is in that's

1501
01:07:47,580 --> 01:07:45,100
right right that's what bothers a lot of

1502
01:07:51,300 --> 01:07:47,590
us if you're doing if you really truly

1503
01:07:55,410 --> 01:07:51,310
are doing it to alter the weather for

1504
01:07:57,180 --> 01:07:55,420
beneficial reasons okay but what what's

1505
01:07:59,010 --> 01:07:57,190
in that step that's gonna hurt us in a

1506
01:08:01,320 --> 01:07:59,020
different way you know cause cancers

1507
01:08:03,990 --> 01:08:01,330
autoimmune diseases we know cancers are

1508
01:08:07,320 --> 01:08:04,000
rising skyrocketing autoimmune diseases

1509
01:08:10,320 --> 01:08:07,330
are skyrocketing with is it what we're

1510
01:08:12,330 --> 01:08:10,330
breathing you know it's just like

1511
01:08:13,260 --> 01:08:12,340
fluoride that's another one all right

1512
01:08:15,900 --> 01:08:13,270
absolutely

1513
01:08:17,430 --> 01:08:15,910
you know anti fluoride what you start

1514
01:08:19,710 --> 01:08:17,440
reading about the stuff and you really

1515
01:08:21,750 --> 01:08:19,720
do the research and you see how the

1516
01:08:23,970 --> 01:08:21,760
mainstream media has covered up some of

1517
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:23,980
these things all right but the first

1518
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:25,570
thing that happens is you get labeled a

1519
01:08:31,380 --> 01:08:29,650
conspiracy nuts so yeah and then your

1520
01:08:37,650 --> 01:08:31,390
chances of getting anything out to the

1521
01:08:40,770 --> 01:08:37,660
public is nail you know people buy your

1522
01:08:42,420 --> 01:08:40,780
stuff speaking of niche to you our

1523
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:42,430
listeners wants to know do you have a

1524
01:08:47,859 --> 01:08:46,090
favorite UFO case and or favorite

1525
01:08:50,229 --> 01:08:47,869
haunting case that you know

1526
01:08:52,329 --> 01:08:50,239
god I've either investigated researched

1527
01:08:54,430 --> 01:08:52,339
or just in general none that I've

1528
01:08:56,410 --> 01:08:54,440
investigated because I'm really kind of

1529
01:08:59,559 --> 01:08:56,420
a skeptic especially it comes to

1530
01:09:02,289 --> 01:08:59,569
Quantum's and ghosts I don't think I've

1531
01:09:03,999 --> 01:09:02,299
ever I've been in a lot of places that

1532
01:09:07,959 --> 01:09:04,009
people say are haunted I've never had

1533
01:09:09,220 --> 01:09:07,969
anything happen to me I'm not counting

1534
01:09:10,950 --> 01:09:09,230
the experiences of other people they do

1535
01:09:13,870 --> 01:09:10,960
think that there are physiological

1536
01:09:17,320 --> 01:09:13,880
reasons for why I may not have and you

1537
01:09:19,359 --> 01:09:17,330
have or somebody else has and I really

1538
01:09:23,470 --> 01:09:19,369
love poltergeist cases the best because

1539
01:09:26,200 --> 01:09:23,480
there they seem to have more visible

1540
01:09:30,189 --> 01:09:26,210
evidence that you know more than one

1541
01:09:32,649 --> 01:09:30,199
person can see and my favorite is is a

1542
01:09:35,680 --> 01:09:32,659
case that has has been very disputed and

1543
01:09:37,930 --> 01:09:35,690
that would be the Tina risk a rush Oh

1544
01:09:40,919 --> 01:09:37,940
what was the name William roll he was a

1545
01:09:43,209 --> 01:09:40,929
psychologist the book was called

1546
01:09:46,899 --> 01:09:43,219
Unleashed I'm trying to remember the

1547
01:09:49,059 --> 01:09:46,909
whole title it was in the early 2000s he

1548
01:09:50,979 --> 01:09:49,069
wrote a book called unleashed it was

1549
01:09:52,780 --> 01:09:50,989
about this young girl that was mana for

1550
01:09:55,600 --> 01:09:52,790
this young woman that was manifesting

1551
01:09:59,140 --> 01:09:55,610
all kinds of craziness any documented

1552
01:10:00,910 --> 01:09:59,150
Indian witnesses cameras blah blah blah

1553
01:10:04,209 --> 01:10:00,920
blah later on down the line

1554
01:10:10,149 --> 01:10:04,219
I guess the amazing Randi you know our

1555
01:10:14,050 --> 01:10:10,159
best pal found a couple of instances

1556
01:10:16,660 --> 01:10:14,060
where Tina was faking now that doesn't

1557
01:10:18,729 --> 01:10:16,670
mean that everything that happened

1558
01:10:20,410 --> 01:10:18,739
earlier was a fake it just means she may

1559
01:10:21,850 --> 01:10:20,420
have caught on that she you know I can

1560
01:10:24,280 --> 01:10:21,860
make some money doing this I don't know

1561
01:10:26,109 --> 01:10:24,290
I'm not gonna judge but but what I loved

1562
01:10:29,109 --> 01:10:26,119
about that case is it was one of the

1563
01:10:32,740 --> 01:10:29,119
first ones that was really documented

1564
01:10:34,570 --> 01:10:32,750
heavily by an academic mm-hm and if

1565
01:10:36,970 --> 01:10:34,580
anybody wants to look into the work of

1566
01:10:39,939 --> 01:10:36,980
William role Unleashed as the name of

1567
01:10:41,649 --> 01:10:39,949
the book you know the Enfield

1568
01:10:43,780 --> 01:10:41,659
poltergeist there's some really cool

1569
01:10:45,490 --> 01:10:43,790
stuff going on but it's hard for me to

1570
01:10:48,189 --> 01:10:45,500
judge because I didn't I'm not there to

1571
01:10:50,109 --> 01:10:48,199
experience it after we have to take the

1572
01:10:52,000 --> 01:10:50,119
words of the people that are when it

1573
01:10:54,550 --> 01:10:52,010
comes to UFOs it's a different story oh

1574
01:10:55,839 --> 01:10:54,560
my god I just I loved everything but

1575
01:10:58,180 --> 01:10:55,849
really I have to tell you my absolute

1576
01:11:01,590 --> 01:10:58,190
favorite I'm gonna try to remember the

1577
01:11:06,720 --> 01:11:01,600
year is being I think early 1960s

1578
01:11:08,310 --> 01:11:06,730
as Lonnie Zamora yeah oh gosh

1579
01:11:13,620 --> 01:11:08,320
let me see if I can find it I have my

1580
01:11:16,950 --> 01:11:13,630
books and stuff yeah it wasn't super New

1581
01:11:20,610 --> 01:11:16,960
Mexico and he was a police officer and a

1582
01:11:24,090 --> 01:11:20,620
witness this amazing event and he became

1583
01:11:25,800 --> 01:11:24,100
sort of a local celebrity I loved that

1584
01:11:27,720 --> 01:11:25,810
and I'll tell you why that was one of

1585
01:11:29,970 --> 01:11:27,730
the first books on UFOs that I wrote

1586
01:11:31,830 --> 01:11:29,980
read it was called a Socorro saucer in a

1587
01:11:34,950 --> 01:11:31,840
Pentagon pantry and I will never forget

1588
01:11:37,340 --> 01:11:34,960
that name because silly name but it

1589
01:11:40,920 --> 01:11:37,350
documented this sort of you know

1590
01:11:43,500 --> 01:11:40,930
whatever New Mexico State Police officer

1591
01:11:45,740 --> 01:11:43,510
who had this life-changing experience

1592
01:11:49,050 --> 01:11:45,750
and then was totally put under

1593
01:11:52,290 --> 01:11:49,060
government scrutiny and the media and I

1594
01:11:53,970 --> 01:11:52,300
love it it's an early 1960s case and

1595
01:11:56,550 --> 01:11:53,980
anybody in the UFO field should read

1596
01:11:59,130 --> 01:11:56,560
about know about and it really kind of

1597
01:12:02,490 --> 01:11:59,140
captured my attention when I was really

1598
01:12:06,330 --> 01:12:02,500
young I loved the the Rendlesham forest

1599
01:12:09,300 --> 01:12:06,340
Bentwaters and burnt out on Roswell

1600
01:12:13,280 --> 01:12:09,310
I'm actually a little more fascinated by

1601
01:12:16,770 --> 01:12:13,290
the Aztec crash yeah I will tell you the

1602
01:12:19,200 --> 01:12:16,780
Hudson Valley waves in the early 1990s

1603
01:12:22,110 --> 01:12:19,210
because my grandparents had a sighting

1604
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:22,120
in Bridgeport Connecticut and I had been

1605
01:12:26,460 --> 01:12:24,130
back there right before it started which

1606
01:12:29,970 --> 01:12:26,470
was a real bummer don't know that I

1607
01:12:32,520 --> 01:12:29,980
missed it modern cases I'm not well

1608
01:12:35,160 --> 01:12:32,530
impressed it seems to have waned quite a

1609
01:12:37,080 --> 01:12:35,170
bit in you know and so funny because we

1610
01:12:39,630 --> 01:12:37,090
have cell phones now and anybody and

1611
01:12:42,090 --> 01:12:39,640
everybody can get documentation and yet

1612
01:12:44,760 --> 01:12:42,100
we're not seeing super high quality

1613
01:12:47,640 --> 01:12:44,770
cases now I you know I don't keep up on

1614
01:12:50,640 --> 01:12:47,650
it as much as I used to so I could be

1615
01:12:52,440 --> 01:12:50,650
wrong but I've not I've not heard of a

1616
01:12:56,220 --> 01:12:52,450
case that everybody is like jumping over

1617
01:12:59,030 --> 01:12:56,230
backwards for in a long time yeah it's a

1618
01:13:01,530 --> 01:12:59,040
it's it's an interesting you know

1619
01:13:03,000 --> 01:13:01,540
conundrum in a way you would think with

1620
01:13:05,580 --> 01:13:03,010
all the technology we have today we

1621
01:13:07,830 --> 01:13:05,590
would get more but that that could say a

1622
01:13:10,680 --> 01:13:07,840
lot about our you know the cultural

1623
01:13:13,230 --> 01:13:10,690
narrative of a UFO sighting and what

1624
01:13:14,970 --> 01:13:13,240
what do we take from that maybe maybe

1625
01:13:15,510 --> 01:13:14,980
we're getting smarter maybe we're

1626
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:15,520
getting too

1627
01:13:19,470 --> 01:13:17,770
when it comes to these things but yeah

1628
01:13:22,260 --> 01:13:19,480
and I think it's cyclical I mean

1629
01:13:24,240 --> 01:13:22,270
certainly UFO waves are you know they we

1630
01:13:26,750 --> 01:13:24,250
prove that there are a lot of UFO

1631
01:13:29,580 --> 01:13:26,760
sighting waves over the course of of

1632
01:13:31,710 --> 01:13:29,590
reportable history right so we may be in

1633
01:13:34,080 --> 01:13:31,720
a down ways but I also think that

1634
01:13:36,630 --> 01:13:34,090
because everybody has a camera we're

1635
01:13:39,900 --> 01:13:36,640
getting a lot more junk there has to be

1636
01:13:41,940 --> 01:13:39,910
a lot more junk sightings to eat through

1637
01:13:45,630 --> 01:13:41,950
and there's not enough people to do that

1638
01:13:47,370 --> 01:13:45,640
to get very quickly to the good stuff

1639
01:13:51,420 --> 01:13:47,380
but there's a lot of UFO research

1640
01:13:54,240 --> 01:13:51,430
researchers out there writing you know

1641
01:13:57,330 --> 01:13:54,250
the old and new that are doing

1642
01:14:01,850 --> 01:13:57,340
incredible work it's just where is that

1643
01:14:04,740 --> 01:14:01,860
that we want that smoking gun darn it

1644
01:14:07,350 --> 01:14:04,750
well maybe we'll get it sooner or later

1645
01:14:10,170 --> 01:14:07,360
Murray would whoever our next leader of

1646
01:14:16,860 --> 01:14:10,180
the free world may be I seriously doubt

1647
01:14:18,380 --> 01:14:16,870
it but for all our disclosure peeps out

1648
01:14:22,050 --> 01:14:18,390
there I apologize

1649
01:14:24,510 --> 01:14:22,060
summary you're working on a few upcoming

1650
01:14:28,470 --> 01:14:24,520
projects including a book about the

1651
01:14:30,360 --> 01:14:28,480
history of evil this is very interesting

1652
01:14:35,100 --> 01:14:30,370
to me can you tell us a little bit more

1653
01:14:36,450 --> 01:14:35,110
about that when you have it I believe it

1654
01:14:39,480 --> 01:14:36,460
will be at the beginning of next year

1655
01:14:42,060 --> 01:14:39,490
this is a monster of a book it's a very

1656
01:14:43,530 --> 01:14:42,070
big reference book but it will be but

1657
01:14:46,140 --> 01:14:43,540
it's also written for the public

1658
01:14:50,820 --> 01:14:46,150
documenting the history of evil the

1659
01:14:53,880 --> 01:14:50,830
devil he'll demons dark angels looking

1660
01:14:57,260 --> 01:14:53,890
at where these concepts originated from

1661
01:15:02,270 --> 01:14:57,270
how they morphed over the years through

1662
01:15:05,610 --> 01:15:02,280
myth and religion and philosophy and

1663
01:15:08,550 --> 01:15:05,620
it's really really big in it I'm ready

1664
01:15:11,970 --> 01:15:08,560
with Larry flax but and just starting on

1665
01:15:15,360 --> 01:15:11,980
looking at the origin of evil it's

1666
01:15:18,510 --> 01:15:15,370
really interesting how the origin of

1667
01:15:21,180 --> 01:15:18,520
words ties in so much to the history of

1668
01:15:23,610 --> 01:15:21,190
the concepts that we've adopted you know

1669
01:15:27,090 --> 01:15:23,620
so looking at the root word of evil or

1670
01:15:28,740 --> 01:15:27,100
Satan or the devil we can learn so much

1671
01:15:31,770 --> 01:15:28,750
about the history of that

1672
01:15:33,930 --> 01:15:31,780
concept and so I'm finding that kind of

1673
01:15:36,120 --> 01:15:33,940
fascinating but it's a it's a big beast

1674
01:15:38,700 --> 01:15:36,130
of a project and I have to tell you that

1675
01:15:40,500 --> 01:15:38,710
I've been warned by several people when

1676
01:15:43,680 --> 01:15:40,510
you write about this stuff weird things

1677
01:15:46,260 --> 01:15:43,690
will happen but Asher and I will be

1678
01:15:49,140 --> 01:15:46,270
damned yes I should say doors I don't

1679
01:15:51,450 --> 01:15:49,150
want to begin yeah but when I first

1680
01:15:52,920 --> 01:15:51,460
started Larry called me couple of we

1681
01:15:55,440 --> 01:15:52,930
talk all the time and he called me a

1682
01:15:57,150 --> 01:15:55,450
couple of times happened and we would be

1683
01:15:58,680 --> 01:15:57,160
talking all that so he looks in Little

1684
01:16:00,390 --> 01:15:58,690
Rock Arkansas so we have to do a lot of

1685
01:16:03,540 --> 01:16:00,400
her work on the phone and all of a

1686
01:16:06,210 --> 01:16:03,550
sudden his voice became demonic I'm not

1687
01:16:07,590 --> 01:16:06,220
kidding you this sort of sounded like an

1688
01:16:09,180 --> 01:16:07,600
altered like you know some kind of

1689
01:16:10,890 --> 01:16:09,190
device to alter your voice and I said

1690
01:16:12,870 --> 01:16:10,900
Larry what are you doing nothing you

1691
01:16:14,250 --> 01:16:12,880
know at your voice you know no you know

1692
01:16:15,990 --> 01:16:14,260
just let me take off my headset I'll

1693
01:16:17,790 --> 01:16:16,000
call you back you call back my headset

1694
01:16:18,440 --> 01:16:17,800
on everything is normal and it would

1695
01:16:21,720 --> 01:16:18,450
happen again

1696
01:16:24,300 --> 01:16:21,730
hmm and it was because for we're talking

1697
01:16:26,370 --> 01:16:24,310
about the book and it would be else

1698
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:26,380
well then a couple of other people that

1699
01:16:30,540 --> 01:16:28,570
I talked I think I was talking to David

1700
01:16:33,180 --> 01:16:30,550
Weatherly and something like that

1701
01:16:35,610 --> 01:16:33,190
happened and or my computer will just

1702
01:16:45,590 --> 01:16:35,620
shut off or it's he goes yeah they're

1703
01:16:51,110 --> 01:16:47,850
the question is who did you sign a

1704
01:16:55,320 --> 01:16:51,120
contract with we're hoping not to do

1705
01:17:00,390 --> 01:16:55,330
publisher I never met him you need to

1706
01:17:02,250 --> 01:17:00,400
meet that person face-to-face and look

1707
01:17:04,950 --> 01:17:02,260
for their origins and things because

1708
01:17:07,410 --> 01:17:04,960
oftentimes it's so much different then

1709
01:17:09,180 --> 01:17:07,420
what we've been taught you know I grew

1710
01:17:11,400 --> 01:17:09,190
up Catholic I'm not a Catholic anymore

1711
01:17:13,470 --> 01:17:11,410
but the things that we've been taught

1712
01:17:18,630 --> 01:17:13,480
about the devil and then Lucifer and

1713
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:18,640
demons and evil when you really research

1714
01:17:25,820 --> 01:17:21,130
and look back at where this began and

1715
01:17:29,900 --> 01:17:25,830
how it unfolded it it shows you how

1716
01:17:33,270 --> 01:17:29,910
organized religion had a big role in

1717
01:17:34,890 --> 01:17:33,280
manipulating the perception of evil the

1718
01:17:36,810 --> 01:17:34,900
perception of Hell is a form of

1719
01:17:39,450 --> 01:17:36,820
punishment and all these other things so

1720
01:17:41,429 --> 01:17:39,460
I'm not banging on religion but it you

1721
01:17:44,370 --> 01:17:41,439
know this is the truth

1722
01:17:46,140 --> 01:17:44,380
we hope to get into all that stuff cool

1723
01:17:47,759 --> 01:17:46,150
I'm really looking forward to that one

1724
01:17:50,939 --> 01:17:47,769
it's definitely gonna keep me up at

1725
01:17:56,850 --> 01:17:50,949
night me probably meet you make me go

1726
01:18:00,270 --> 01:17:56,860
back to church we'll see come a devout

1727
01:18:05,899 --> 01:18:00,280
Catholic again I know you're um I don't

1728
01:18:11,609 --> 01:18:09,359
and raise a child it's just it's it's

1729
01:18:14,219 --> 01:18:11,619
amazing all the work you do prolific

1730
01:18:16,739 --> 01:18:14,229
you're working on another major project

1731
01:18:18,750 --> 01:18:16,749
dealing with a prominent family company

1732
01:18:23,009 --> 01:18:18,760
is there anything you could clue us in

1733
01:18:25,790 --> 01:18:23,019
on yeah eventually you know I was a

1734
01:18:29,069 --> 01:18:25,800
screenwriter from way back in the day a

1735
01:18:31,049 --> 01:18:29,079
couple years ago or four years ago

1736
01:18:33,330 --> 01:18:31,059
started with the manager we were working

1737
01:18:35,790 --> 01:18:33,340
on novels and this that and we finally

1738
01:18:37,919 --> 01:18:35,800
decided that because I I'm really good

1739
01:18:40,649 --> 01:18:37,929
at producing let's get you into

1740
01:18:43,439 --> 01:18:40,659
producing so for the past year I've been

1741
01:18:47,159 --> 01:18:43,449
optioning property he's developing them

1742
01:18:49,229 --> 01:18:47,169
I now have 20 summer my own I just had a

1743
01:18:49,919 --> 01:18:49,239
script of mine optioned which was really

1744
01:18:52,319 --> 01:18:49,929
wonderful

1745
01:18:54,239 --> 01:18:52,329
Wow congratulations yeah thank you I'm

1746
01:18:57,449 --> 01:18:54,249
so through it's a science fiction script

1747
01:18:58,919 --> 01:18:57,459
and I'm so thrilled but I love writing

1748
01:19:00,359 --> 01:18:58,929
fiction I love writing screenplays

1749
01:19:01,589 --> 01:19:00,369
because these are other ways that you

1750
01:19:03,600 --> 01:19:01,599
can convey the things that you're

1751
01:19:05,399 --> 01:19:03,610
passionate about and obviously a lot of

1752
01:19:08,009 --> 01:19:05,409
my stuff is about the stuff that we've

1753
01:19:09,689 --> 01:19:08,019
talked about today however this one

1754
01:19:11,669 --> 01:19:09,699
project the very first project that my

1755
01:19:14,339 --> 01:19:11,679
manager brought to me was the story of

1756
01:19:18,959 --> 01:19:14,349
the Maybelline Dynasty Maybelline

1757
01:19:22,049 --> 01:19:18,969
Cosmetics and it I was reading the the

1758
01:19:24,120 --> 01:19:22,059
Grammys of the founder her memoirs and

1759
01:19:26,189 --> 01:19:24,130
just and I didn't have any idea at the

1760
01:19:28,589 --> 01:19:26,199
time why I was asked to read it I

1761
01:19:31,560 --> 01:19:28,599
thought I just I'm supposed to help like

1762
01:19:33,929 --> 01:19:31,570
edit it or something and it was so

1763
01:19:35,580 --> 01:19:33,939
fascinating that I looked forward every

1764
01:19:38,159 --> 01:19:35,590
week I would get a new section of the

1765
01:19:40,529 --> 01:19:38,169
book here read this that when it stopped

1766
01:19:44,719 --> 01:19:40,539
I cried my eyes out was like I dis

1767
01:19:49,939 --> 01:19:44,729
family oh my god I mean it's like Dallas

1768
01:19:54,149 --> 01:19:49,949
with cosmetics it is absolutely shocking

1769
01:19:55,029 --> 01:19:54,159
the history of the Maybelline em part so

1770
01:19:57,219 --> 01:19:55,039
it's one of the biggest

1771
01:20:00,399 --> 01:19:57,229
brands oh yeah it's it's absolutely

1772
01:20:02,199 --> 01:20:00,409
iconic and so finally I said why did you

1773
01:20:03,789 --> 01:20:02,209
make me read this and my manager said I

1774
01:20:07,149 --> 01:20:03,799
want you to produce I want you to

1775
01:20:11,859 --> 01:20:07,159
develop this as a TV series as a sir

1776
01:20:14,020 --> 01:20:11,869
and I don't know how to do that are you

1777
01:20:16,959 --> 01:20:14,030
serious and that happened quite a while

1778
01:20:19,750 --> 01:20:16,969
ago it's actually now in making the

1779
01:20:21,609 --> 01:20:19,760
rounds it's some pretty big networks and

1780
01:20:24,250 --> 01:20:21,619
what-have-you and her fingers are

1781
01:20:28,299 --> 01:20:24,260
crossed it's just an absolutely stunning

1782
01:20:30,699 --> 01:20:28,309
story and about the founder who found

1783
01:20:32,589 --> 01:20:30,709
the company when he was 19 you know just

1784
01:20:34,959 --> 01:20:32,599
the hell that that family went through

1785
01:20:37,389 --> 01:20:34,969
so that was really exciting and then I

1786
01:20:40,299 --> 01:20:37,399
started to option more properties and I

1787
01:20:42,399 --> 01:20:40,309
have my own properties of mine that have

1788
01:20:44,349 --> 01:20:42,409
been developed that are in play so I

1789
01:20:46,750 --> 01:20:44,359
loved I loved producing this is what I

1790
01:20:50,679 --> 01:20:46,760
was meant to do but I'm not forgetting

1791
01:20:52,629 --> 01:20:50,689
my my non-fiction books but the funny

1792
01:20:54,369 --> 01:20:52,639
thing is like you know Larry and I have

1793
01:20:56,949 --> 01:20:54,379
been racking our brains what in the

1794
01:20:59,669 --> 01:20:56,959
paranormal do you want to write about it

1795
01:21:03,099 --> 01:20:59,679
hasn't been written about either by us

1796
01:21:05,020 --> 01:21:03,109
or our colleagues because you know your

1797
01:21:07,869 --> 01:21:05,030
colleagues are out there writing you've

1798
01:21:15,189 --> 01:21:07,879
got a book I mean it's hard to think of

1799
01:21:17,020 --> 01:21:15,199
anything new new things with us but no

1800
01:21:23,889 --> 01:21:17,030
Nick Bradford's written everything yeah

1801
01:21:25,779 --> 01:21:23,899
oh guy writes a book Larry and I

1802
01:21:28,239 --> 01:21:25,789
actually have three concepts that we're

1803
01:21:30,849 --> 01:21:28,249
developing together that have paranormal

1804
01:21:32,739 --> 01:21:30,859
science II you know quantum physics

1805
01:21:35,439 --> 01:21:32,749
time-travel elements that's kind of

1806
01:21:38,259 --> 01:21:35,449
another fun way to take what you're

1807
01:21:40,509 --> 01:21:38,269
passionate about and expressive it and

1808
01:21:43,059 --> 01:21:40,519
you note that oh yeah absolutely it's

1809
01:21:44,979 --> 01:21:43,069
yeah that's exciting and you know the

1810
01:21:46,509 --> 01:21:44,989
worlds of nonfiction and fiction always

1811
01:21:49,270 --> 01:21:46,519
meld at some point or another and

1812
01:21:52,239 --> 01:21:49,280
there's things you can glean from the

1813
01:21:55,419 --> 01:21:52,249
fiction that you could take with you as

1814
01:21:57,250 --> 01:21:55,429
as fact oh yeah I mean we're pretty

1815
01:21:58,750 --> 01:21:57,260
blatant about we have a project Larry

1816
01:22:00,429 --> 01:21:58,760
they have a project called grid walkers

1817
01:22:02,529 --> 01:22:00,439
that is based on our non-fiction book

1818
01:22:03,969 --> 01:22:02,539
the grid right right we take a lot of

1819
01:22:05,589 --> 01:22:03,979
the theories and the science and the

1820
01:22:07,929 --> 01:22:05,599
Tesla research and this that the

1821
01:22:08,860 --> 01:22:07,939
time-travel and we you know it's so fun

1822
01:22:10,960 --> 01:22:08,870
to be able to do that

1823
01:22:14,440 --> 01:22:10,970
as you can do in fiction so much more

1824
01:22:16,900 --> 01:22:14,450
right exactly them and yet still present

1825
01:22:19,450 --> 01:22:16,910
some solid we like to call it science

1826
01:22:21,670 --> 01:22:19,460
faction because you really are blending

1827
01:22:31,240 --> 01:22:21,680
the two and it's really kind of fun I

1828
01:22:35,110 --> 01:22:31,250
like that got to put the old TM on the

1829
01:22:37,270 --> 01:22:35,120
end of that one yes so where can we find

1830
01:22:40,900 --> 01:22:37,280
more about your fiction your nonfiction

1831
01:22:45,100 --> 01:22:40,910
your screenplays give us a link I will

1832
01:22:49,570 --> 01:22:45,110
well my website for my books is Murray D

1833
01:22:53,670 --> 01:22:49,580
Jones calm my website for my movie

1834
01:22:56,800 --> 01:22:53,680
projects I'm developing is where's Lucy

1835
01:22:59,980 --> 01:22:56,810
productions.com all one word where's

1836
01:23:01,510 --> 01:22:59,990
Lucy productions calm and my son named

1837
01:23:04,120 --> 01:23:01,520
at that because I couldn't figure out a

1838
01:23:07,240 --> 01:23:04,130
name for the production company got a

1839
01:23:11,290 --> 01:23:07,250
cat named Lucy and we either one of us

1840
01:23:13,300 --> 01:23:11,300
25 times a day where's Lucy yeah trouble

1841
01:23:15,370 --> 01:23:13,310
where's lid so my son said mom why don't

1842
01:23:18,760 --> 01:23:15,380
you just call it where's Lucy that's

1843
01:23:24,730 --> 01:23:18,770
great yeah you always wonder where these

1844
01:23:26,140 --> 01:23:24,740
production company names come from well

1845
01:23:30,100 --> 01:23:26,150
it's great to hear that your son is also

1846
01:23:33,520 --> 01:23:30,110
your co-producer that give him some

1847
01:23:35,820 --> 01:23:33,530
money yeah that's what trust funds are

1848
01:23:38,830 --> 01:23:35,830
for exactly yes

1849
01:23:40,780 --> 01:23:38,840
Wow this has been just an extremely

1850
01:23:43,960 --> 01:23:40,790
fascinating conversation and I honestly

1851
01:23:47,880 --> 01:23:43,970
I can say that my mind has been

1852
01:23:52,900 --> 01:23:50,680
I've loved it I know the listeners well

1853
01:23:53,650 --> 01:23:52,910
I can't wait to see what you come up

1854
01:23:56,560 --> 01:23:53,660
with next

1855
01:24:09,990 --> 01:23:56,570
in everything ray thank you so so much

1856
01:24:31,350 --> 01:24:24,850
[Music]

1857
01:24:36,310 --> 01:24:33,970
have you ever rewashed a movie from the

1858
01:24:39,130 --> 01:24:36,320
past did it hold up or did you regret it

1859
01:24:41,350 --> 01:24:39,140
immediately no need to re-watch the mask

1860
01:24:43,240 --> 01:24:41,360
or look who's talking alone or the

1861
01:24:45,400 --> 01:24:43,250
rewatch ability podcast and each week we

1862
01:24:47,230 --> 01:24:45,410
jump back in time to revisit movies and

1863
01:24:50,170 --> 01:24:47,240
TV shows to see if they stand the test

1864
01:24:52,270 --> 01:24:50,180
of time we laugh we'll cry we'll discuss

1865
01:24:54,340 --> 01:24:52,280
a surprising amount of racism and

1866
01:24:56,260 --> 01:24:54,350
misogyny in our favorite movies from

1867
01:24:58,270 --> 01:24:56,270
Twin Peaks to Forrest Gump to the Jungle

1868
01:25:00,220 --> 01:24:58,280
Book we watch movies and TV from any

1869
01:25:02,140 --> 01:25:00,230
genre and any decade you can subscribe

1870
01:25:04,540 --> 01:25:02,150
and listen to our podcast on iTunes

1871
01:25:06,610 --> 01:25:04,550
rewatchable e decom or your local

1872
01:25:09,370 --> 01:25:06,620
podcast network you can also follow us